Other Rule Bilge pumps

[Vumad]

I am running the Rule 500. I am going through a bilge every year. I seem to be having more issues with impellers coming off the shaft than anything else. I don't have stuff getting stuck in the pump. I keep my hull clean and clear. The only thing I can think of being a problem is running them dry. I run them non-stop in the surf and when I am trying to learn flat water stuff like subs. I take on some water and my ski pumps as needed but does run dry a lot. I have the stock siphon and don't run the bilge unless I am doing something that might hurt my boat if it is not on (have bar mounted switch). My bilge on my SJ is just about a year old and is not working. I haven't pulled it out but it runs but doesn't pump water. The last 3 or 4 bilges I pulled out of my X2 ran but the impellers had come off the shaft (also lasting about 1 yr). I took them out and they just flop around in the housing. What's going on here? These things are $35 each and I hate spending the time to replace them.

 

[Chasing wakes]

Running them dry could be your problem. These pumps are made to pump water out. If the pump is being ran and no water is going through that can very easily destroy your pump. Also the fact that you run them non stop every time you ride could also be a factor. Just try turning on your bilge as needed. I can usually tell when my boat has water inside that's when I flick the switch and let it run for a while until I see no more water coming out. Skis are gonna get water inside no matter what. If you have good gaskets and seals I wouldn't worry about a little bit of water.

 

[OCD Solutions]

I tried running Atwood's for a couple years with similar results so I switched back to Rule's. They say they are good to run empty but everything has it's limits right? Empty and dry are two very different scenarios.
My wife left her bilge running after a ride and I didn't discover it until I went to flush it many hours later and found the battery dead. It started blowing fuses and I replaced both pumps very shortly after that.

 

[Vumad]

I don't run it just to run it. Only when doing high risk activities. Part of the problem is I came from a X2, which ran dual bilges at all times. The SJ doesn't take on water very much so I need to get comfortable with not using it. The X2 is still going to have 2 bilges but I'm going to do 2 switches this time.

I wish there was a way to just press on a new impeller. Everyone of these bilges I remove have ran but just have impeller damage and wont pump anymore.

 

[howieris]

Prolly the constant running and salt is causing the failures. My bilges are on there 3-4 year on my SJ and X2.

 

[JetManiac]

Running dry will not hurt them. Motor is sealed and doesnt know or care if there is water on the impeller. Low voltage and/or poor quality connections are more likely causes of failure.

Connections should be soldered then glue lined heat shrink for use in saltwater. Standard crimp connections will quickly corrode and develop high resistance connections.

 

[Vumad]

Running dry will not hurt them. Motor is sealed and doesnt know or care if there is water on the impeller. Low voltage and/or poor quality connections are more likely causes of failure.

Connections should be soldered then glue lined heat shrink for use in saltwater. Standard crimp connections will quickly corrode and develop high resistance connections.

The impellers are coming off. I'm not sure on this pump, as I haven't taken it off yet, but the last several are the impellers. They run, the shaft spins. I take them out and the impeller is just floating around in the housing. I don't think of the 4 or 5 I've replaced have any of them failed electrically. They always make the running sound and it appears that the shaft is spinning, but the impellers are just floating. The one in my SJ makes the noise, I can feel it vibrating when I put my hand on it, but it doesn't pump water. I felt around but doesn't appear anything is in the strainer. I'll take it out next week. I don't think the wiring would cause impeller failure, would it?

Normally I do my connections like this...
Connect with shrink wrap connector. Put silicone in the shrink wrap. Shrink the wrap from outside to inside so silicone pushes into the connection. None of my bilge failures have been at the wire connections.

The 1st time I had an impeller fail, I found a zip tie cut off end in the strainer. Since then, I have been careful and there's no stuff floating around in my hull anymore.

 

[227]

I have never had the impeller come off a bilge, but I also don't run them the entire time. Can you epoxy the impeller back on? I dislike the 500 rules for another reason, The main problem I 've had with them is that they seem to cavitate badly in the airated water churned up by the drive shaft coupler and fail to pump. I started running a Rule 1000 and the cavitation problem seemed to go away. If you think continueous running is your problem, and you can't get the manuel switch thing down, DJ Korn runs an automatic switch that he swears by. Maybe he'll chime in or you can PM him.

 

[naticen]

I run a water witch 101 with a rule 500 in both mine and my girl's skis and leave batteries hooked up as long as we are riding weekly. Everything lasts for years with no problems and there is no need to ever flip a switch. They only run 10-30 seconds every few to 10 minutes depending on conditions. This is all salt riding. I also leave in the stock siphons too. I also rinse down the inside of the hull and let the bilge pump it all out too. That might help keep the impeller from getting salted up, although it is plastic and I don't really see how.

 

[tor*p*do]

my rule 500s get turned on when my skis leave the trailer
and run until it gets back on the trailer
I get 3 - 5 years out of the 500s

 

[gc4]

I do the same as torpedo. On season 5 for my attwood V500 (not looking forward to when this finally goes, way better at not air-locking like the rules) and got 2 seasons out of my rule 500 but that was only because a zip-tie got caught in it and burned it out.

These pumps are made to run dry. Maybe you have been buying pumps that came from the same stock shipment that all have the same manufacturing defect?

 

[B3IS]

I would blame the salt water.

 

[vomitspot]

i hate bilge pumps , just like insurance
ya gotta have it
rule 500 here
i dont soldier or glue krimp or any that hi tech stuff its still gonna fail
i just use reg crip connectors that way when it fails or needs to be removed for whatever i can just cut and recrimp

 

[davy87nj]

I had my switch mounted under the hood. It runs all the time when Im riding. Rule 500. Bilge pump it self had no issues, but poor connections I thought I could get away with in salt water turned to green powder and now I have an open circuit. I learned alot about salt water this season, one little knick or exposed wire will fail. This happened with my S/S switch also when I tried to extend a couch one in my SN. I knicked the wire with a razor blade unknowingly, started to fail on the second ride.

 

[kcmasterpiece]

hmmm, I go through a pump every season too. Mine just broke today. The impeller broke on mine. its just dancing around in there... I'm a set it and forget it guy. Its on all day for me too. I never really worried too much about it. for me, it's just one of those things that just cant take the beating we give them..

looks like im running out to get a new one for tomorrows New Years ride!

 

[Vumad]

hmmm, I go through a pump every season too. Mine just broke today. The impeller broke on mine. its just dancing around in there... I'm a set it and forget it guy. Its on all day for me too. I never really worried too much about it. for me, it's just one of those things that just cant take the beating we give them..

looks like im running out to get a new one for tomorrows New Years ride!

Yup, that's the problem. Sounds like my bilge takes less abuse than yours too.

Might be the salt water swelling the shaft and making the impeller come loose.

One of mine the hole was really wallowed out.


For those who are saying they last 3-4 years, are those fresh water only boats? Is yours a salt water boat too KC?

I flush my ski very well when I'm done. I don't use salt away, but it gets a very good wash down. Everything I can see gets wd40 or silicone but I can't see the bilge.

 

[Gyro]

The glue inside that heatshrink is just hot glue. Because this stuff only seems to be available in black, I do it like this...
Squeeze clear hot glue onto my solder joint (messy, hot, ouch!) and wait for it to harden. Slide a section of clear heat shrink over the top and warm it with a heat gun until the glue flows again. The result is a waterproof joint which can be visually inspected.
At work, I've made countless underground wire joins like this over the last 15 years and never had a failure. (yet)
I have though, found countless crimp joins embedded in ordinary plumbers silicone which have failed. Don't ask me how water gets past the silicone, it just does.

The bigger Rule pumps have water sensing switches which look like this.

They seem to be made for Rule by the same mob who make LevelGuard products.
http://levelguardproducts.com/marine-rv/sumbersible-bilge-pump-control.php#.UOK9y9Erszk
I put the “SensaSwitch Ultra Bilge Pump Control” in my ski and it works very reliably.

Can't comment on why the Rule 500s fail at the shaft, my bilge has been installed less than a year.
Now I'm wondering how long it'll last?

Try the clear hot glue and heatshrink.

 

[Vumad]

I just replaced the bilge. It had the same problem as the last. The impeller is just floating around in there.

I never paid much attention before. Comparing the new and old. The new has a piece of the shaft that stick out of the impeller. It would appear that the impeller shaft on my old bilge completely disintegrated.

The problem I have been having is the impeller shaft completely rusting away to nothing. Every bilge I have replaced has had this or a similar problem. Pretty disappointing.

Lots of people posted about electrical problems with the bilges. I have never had one with an electrical problem. I use shrink wrap connectors. I crimp them, mush dielectric grease into them, then heat them from the outer edge inward. I cover the terminals and the switch (when I have an open switch, my SJ has a sealed switch) with dielectric grease. No electrical problems.

Too bad it doesn't work for the shafts. I was considering trying the auto bilge, but seeing my problem is the shaft rusting away and the auto bilges are $70 instead of $35, I'll keep what I have.

 

[Vumad]

I think I got it. I don't dry my hull with a towel. Maybe I'll try that from now on and see if it changes anything. My bilge is probably constantly sitting in 1/4" of water. I never thought much of it because the water doesn't touch anything else, but it's probably rotting my impeller shafts.

 

[B3IS]

Maybe lift the rear of your ski when it is in the garage so the extra water sits in the front of the hull and not in contact with the bilge.
Just and idea. Since I built My new ski I run it on my hitch hauler, so when not on the truck it is on the beach dolly leaning forward.