TL S/S Switch

Nate_D

Nate_D

Location
Houston, TX
I'm going to be wiring up a TL and I don't want to run a second switch to turn the brain off. Has anyone split off the start button from the lanyard and used the start side of the lanyard wiring to the IGN lead on the brain? Stop leads would still run to the kill lead, and start button would run independent of the lanyard to the starter relay.

Lanyard in, brain powers on and stop side of switch becomes open. Stop button still grounds kill wire.

Lanyard out, brain shuts off (start circuit open) and kill wire becomes grounded.

Starter works independently of lanyard. (Can't think of a reason it really needs to be tied to the lanyard switch, other than idiot proofing)

Would this work, or am I misunderstanding the circuits here?


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Ducky

Ducky

Back in the game!
Location
Charlotte, NC
Im not sure if this is the same thing, but have you looked into the shifty module for TL? Sounds like what you are trying to do?
 
Christian_83

Christian_83

Xscream
Location
Denmark
My Shifty module died after 10 hours. i wrote Shifty but got no reply.
Im not sure i follow how you would spilt the start button? Can you draw a diagram of this? My first thought is that it wound work, because the start button only has one function and without extra relays i cant see how it would "hold" the positive 12v+ alive to the brain?
 
Nate_D

Nate_D

Location
Houston, TX
Yes. the shifty module basically does this without cutting up a start stop switch. It achieves the same thing, but I think it also converts the kill switch to trigger a relay to open the IGN circuit, shutting off the brain. Which would be preferably to grounding the kill wire (or so I would assume). Basically I'm trying not to buy a shifty module (I'm being cheap).


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Nate_D

Nate_D

Location
Houston, TX
Christian_83 said:
My Shifty module died after 10 hours. i wrote Shifty but got no reply.
Im not sure i follow how you would spilt the start button? Can you draw a diagram of this? My first thought is that it wound work, because the start button only has one function and without extra relays i cant see how it would "hold" the positive 12v+ alive to the brain?
Click to expand...

If I'm not mistaken, the start circuit switches are wired in series. When the lanyard is in, the first switch becomes closed. The second switch (button) is still open, not engaging the starter relay until it is pushed, then closing both switches and completing the circuit to the starter relay. The stop side of the lanyard switch is wired in parallel. It is normally closed when the lanyard is removed, and become open when the lanyard is added. The button is normally open.

I'll draw up a diagram.


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Nate_D

Nate_D

Location
Houston, TX
Please excuse my crude drawing and handwriting.

e7a0267f0b36a1c72007b6f4e85483f7.jpg


S/S switch normal wiring

eddb7105cb8513503e63b1af268e91b4.jpg


(Note that the stop circuit on the lanyard switch is closed when removed and the start circuit is open when moved. Reversed when lanyard is in)



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Christian_83

Christian_83

Xscream
Location
Denmark
The first drawing, Where would you get thw Contact set for the msd from? From the start Button?
It looks like you would Use the realy fuction from the stop side, but Will mix it with ar 12v+?
 
Nate_D

Nate_D

Location
Houston, TX
Christian_83 said:
The first drawing, Where would you get thw Contact set for the msd from? From the start Button?
Click to expand...

The lanyard switch. When the lanyard is inserted it both opens the kill/stop circuit and closes the start button circuit. Basically I would run 2 more wires up to the start/stop switch and separate the start button from the lanyard switch. Start button would be on its own circuit, and the start side of the lanyard switch would control the IGN wire of the TL. The stop switch would remain untouched and would be connected to the pink kill wire and ground.

If I understand the TL diagram correctly, there are two ways to kill spark: turn off the power to the brain or ground the kill wire. If the lanyard was pulled out it would open the 12v circuit and turn off power to the brain. If the stop button was pressed, it would ground the kill wire. The start button would be wired directly to the relay.



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Christian_83

Christian_83

Xscream
Location
Denmark
Nate_D said:
The lanyard switch. When the lanyard is inserted it both opens the kill/stop circuit and closes the start button circuit. Basically I would run 2 more wires up to the start/stop switch and separate the start button from the lanyard switch. Start button would be on its own circuit, and the start side of the lanyard switch would control the IGN wire of the TL. The stop switch would remain untouched and would be connected to the pink kill wire and ground.

If i understand it correctly you would still need a extra relay or switch to hook up to the stop switch?
Were would you hook up the two extra wires you would pull into the SS housing?
Click to expand...
 
Nate_D

Nate_D

Location
Houston, TX
augustaf said:
The most suitable conversion would be a automotive solid state latching relay. They can be a bit pricey, but if mass produced cheaper. For example: http://www.amazon.com/5-Pin-Relay-1...qid=1441555525&sr=8-5&keywords=latching+relay
Click to expand...

Not familiar with a latching relay, but I looked at wiring a standard 12v relay and it will draw current while the MSD is off. What is different about the latching relay? (Haven't looked at it yet)

Christian,

You have 4 "switches" in your start/stop switch assembly. The lanyard is actually one switch with two sets of contacts that turn on/off there respective circuits independently of each other. They are in the reverse state of each other as well. So when one is off, the other is on. Forgetting about the button, one of the switches is going to be "ON" when the lanyard is in, the other switch is going to be "OFF". What I am thinking to do, is use the switch that is "ON" while the lanyard is in to connect to the ignition circuit on the TL instead of using an external switch. When the lanyard is inserted the TL turn on, and when it's pulled, the TL turns off. This happens to be the brown start leads. The start button would be cut, and then the brown lead from the lanyard switch would get wired to the brown lead going down to the connector.

The second part is making the stop button work to kill the spark on the TL through the pink wire. The pink wire needs to be grounded, so the switch needs to be normally open, or OFF. Since this is exactly how the OEM CDI works, you don't need to cut off any button or connect any new leads. The black/white wires would go to the pink and ground. When the lanyard is in, both of the switches are open, or OFF. Removing the lanyard or pushing the stop button would ground the pink wire. Of course removing the lanyard already kill power to the brain, but why bother cutting the stop button if you don't have to.

The two extra wires running into the housing would connect the start button that we cut off earlier, to 12v and the brown start relay wire. With this wiring you could spin your starter while the lanyard is out, of course making no spark. I'm not really sure why yamaha didn't just wire the start circuit like this to begin with and do away with the overly complex lanyard switch for a simpler one.


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Dartman

Dartman

Location
usa
Nate_D said:
With this wiring you could spin your starter while the lanyard is out, of course making no spark. I'm not really sure why yamaha didn't just wire the start circuit like this to begin with and do away with the overly complex lanyard switch for a simpler one.


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Click to expand...

for one if you had kids playing in the garage...you would want this as kids love to push buttons like daddy does!
 
J

jason184

Location
Annapolis, MD
speedysprocket said:
I just disconnect my battery cables... Tried several switches, and the more stuff you have to play with it salt water, the worse off you are...
Click to expand...

Have you had any problems from leaving the MSD on without the ski running? The switch seems to be the most unreliable part of my total loss set up. I always unhook my battery at the end of the day when I'm done riding anyway.
 
Last edited:
speedysprocket

speedysprocket

Alex
Location
Chesapeake, VA
jason184 said:
Have you had any problems from leaving the MSD on without the ski running? The switch seems to be the most unreliable part of my total loss set up. I always unhook my battery at the end of the day when I'm done riding anyway.
Click to expand...
No. If I come in for a break or gas, I leave it connected. If I'm getting lunch or done for the day, I disconnect it.
 
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