makejetskiinggreatagain
Brandon
Are stand ups still allowed there? I've heard some say that newer ones are (which doesnt make sense to me), and that all are banned. So should i or shouldnt i plan a trip there this summer? ha ha.
Other Whats the deal with powell?
- Thread starter makejetskiinggreatagain
- Start date
- Location
- Rockwall TX
2 strokes are not allowed on Powell any longer.
makejetskiinggreatagain
Brandon
stupid ******* tree huggin yuppies....
- Location
- Lake Havasu City, AZ USA
The only thing banned is 2 stroke PWC only, all other 2 strokes are aloud. So..... Grandpa Joe and his 1969 5hp Johnson outboard that smokes like a bitch can still go out on the lake. Its BS, and SUPER discriminative!(for now).
They are banning lakes on the CO. river that are part of National parks. This ban is Lake Powell, Lake Mead, and Lake Mohave. The ban ends at Davis dam in Laughlin, NV which is the last dam for Lake Mohave. Anything south of there is anybodies game as it is not any part of a national park(Lake Havasu, Parker Strip, all the way to Imperial Dam near the Mexican border.
Old 2 stokes that have been retrofitted with a fuel injection system are permitted. Obviously all 4 strokes are permitted.
All i can say is there is gonna come a time for everyone here in the US when the 2 stroke ban will be in full force. They will slowly be phasing it in over the next 10 years.
They are banning lakes on the CO. river that are part of National parks. This ban is Lake Powell, Lake Mead, and Lake Mohave. The ban ends at Davis dam in Laughlin, NV which is the last dam for Lake Mohave. Anything south of there is anybodies game as it is not any part of a national park(Lake Havasu, Parker Strip, all the way to Imperial Dam near the Mexican border.
Old 2 stokes that have been retrofitted with a fuel injection system are permitted. Obviously all 4 strokes are permitted.
All i can say is there is gonna come a time for everyone here in the US when the 2 stroke ban will be in full force. They will slowly be phasing it in over the next 10 years.
227
Its all about the surf!
- Location
- Oceanside, CA
I find it hard to believe there isn't a 2 stroke friendly lawyer in our riding community that hasn't started putting a class action lawsuit together to address this. Since the ban is only for jet skis, its clearly not an environmental issue, its just plain old discrimination. What we need is a half black, half American Indian Women Lawyer with a typa A personality who loves Jet skis and has a chip on her shoulder against treehuggers to go to bat for us. Any takers???
Singling out a particular kind of craft is not discrimination in a legal sense. Who operates the craft/what race the lawyer is has nothing to do with it, either.
There are plenty of other places nationwide that do not allow PWC.
And you know what? The way that most people operate the majority of PWC out there, I wouldn't want them on my lake, either.
Sure it sucks for those that ride responsibly. But most don't.
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227
Its all about the surf!
- Location
- Oceanside, CA
Replied in your quote, Sorry I don't know how to do a multi quote reply
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wsuwrhr
Purveyor of the Biggest Brapp
- Location
- Alta Loma, working in Upland
You do understand "baby steps" right?
It is very hard in this country to do big bans, because of our legal process, but small steps is all it takes, especially when you can pit one group against another.
It is hard to take down a big group, but if you can single out the large groups into smaller ones, and then get THEIR support for your agenda, they will even fight for you. It works perfectly, many are pawns in that very scheme.
Just look around, all around you.
Brian
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The discrimination that you're thinking of (the legal kind that you can sue over) applies to people, not inanimate objects or animals or anything else. It's perfectly legal to ban a particular kind of vehicle if the legislative body can garner the required number of votes.
Sure, a particular kind of craft is being discriminated. Just warning you that crying "discrimination!" isn't going to help.
Anyway, it's too little too late. We're too small a group with too little influence and not enough money to make any sort of difference on this.
makejetskiinggreatagain
Brandon
THE CASE FOR DISCRIMINATION agains PEOPLE:
I think the case for discrimination could be argued as such. 2 stroke PWC's are being banned. 2 stroke fishing boats are not being banned, 2 stroke power boats are not being banned, 4 stroke PWC's are not being banned. So if its not PWC's and if its not an environmental case, what are they banning then? They are ok with PWC's and they're ok with 2 stroke engines polluting their water. So who is it they are attempting to elminiate from their lakes? I think its quite clear. Aside from a few exceptions, the majority of PWC's running on 2 stroke engines are older models, and can therefore be assumed they cost less to purchase/own. I think it is safe to also assume that only wealthier folks own newer models, and the older models are bought by lower income families trying to find a fun toy for less money. Are they not, then, trying to discriminate against the poorer individuals (taken in context of course - you dont see homeless people with a jetski lol)?
I think the case for discrimination could be argued as such. 2 stroke PWC's are being banned. 2 stroke fishing boats are not being banned, 2 stroke power boats are not being banned, 4 stroke PWC's are not being banned. So if its not PWC's and if its not an environmental case, what are they banning then? They are ok with PWC's and they're ok with 2 stroke engines polluting their water. So who is it they are attempting to elminiate from their lakes? I think its quite clear. Aside from a few exceptions, the majority of PWC's running on 2 stroke engines are older models, and can therefore be assumed they cost less to purchase/own. I think it is safe to also assume that only wealthier folks own newer models, and the older models are bought by lower income families trying to find a fun toy for less money. Are they not, then, trying to discriminate against the poorer individuals (taken in context of course - you dont see homeless people with a jetski lol)?
makejetskiinggreatagain
Brandon
Throw that in their face and then let them explain what it IS they are attempting to do. What are they going to be able to say?
They're not going to say anything because they'll be busy laughing at you. There is no law on the books anywhere that prohibits discrimination based on your choice of watercraft.
You might just as well argue that you're being discriminated against because you shop at Costco.
Sorry. That battle has been over for a while now.
You might just as well argue that you're being discriminated against because you shop at Costco.
Sorry. That battle has been over for a while now.
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makejetskiinggreatagain
Brandon
You're right, they probably would just laugh.
"If a wise man has an argument with a fool, the fool only rages and laughs, and there is no quiet."
"If a wise man has an argument with a fool, the fool only rages and laughs, and there is no quiet."
makejetskiinggreatagain
Brandon
:banghead: I think you're taking this way too serious my man. smile a little :Banane25:
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- Location
- Las Vegas
And a big problem with all this is that depending on who you talk to, you get a different answer. Most of our info is related to Lake Mead, but even some guy at Powell was told this would be an "education year".
Many riders here have contacted the actual Rangers, NDOW, NPS, etc. and nobody gets a straight answer. We've been told it's an education year and we'll be allowed to ride the year out. We've heard they'll give us a few warnings and then kick us off, fine us, etc. Some Rangers said it's a Fed law and they are state so they'll leave us alone. Some NPS say it's stupid and won't mess with us since we clean up the beaches and other things, like save drowning swimmers and help stranded boaters. Depending on who you talk to at the offices and the day of the week you get a different answer.
At one point they (NDOW website) even said that affordable kits exist to make our skis legal. Somebody asked where they got the info as no such thing exists and they realized they were horns-waggled on things they were told about the ban and skis, including the pollution aspect. These guys honestly believed we polluted something like 40% of our fuel unburned through the exhaust. Yep the ban is all built on lies.
The Rangers and NPS are spread super thin as it is too. Last year riding once or twice a week from March to November I saw a Ranger twice. Saw NPS a few times, but the old guy likes us and would cruise by our spot just to BS with us and let us know he won't bother kicking us out after the ban. I know on the weekends at our spot the riders saw the rangers a few times but I don't ride on weekends. Their was something mentioned that 30k (or some other ridiculous number) 2-stroke pwc were registered in Clark County alone. Take that at $20 a ski (actually more with annual lake pass and new quagga fee) plus the tow vehicles annual passes and they are losing more money and being able to staff less people.
Also most Rangers were not very knowledgeable about skis as it was, how they are going to train all these people is beyond me. Not to mention they cannot stop you from entering the lake with a ski.
Many riders here have contacted the actual Rangers, NDOW, NPS, etc. and nobody gets a straight answer. We've been told it's an education year and we'll be allowed to ride the year out. We've heard they'll give us a few warnings and then kick us off, fine us, etc. Some Rangers said it's a Fed law and they are state so they'll leave us alone. Some NPS say it's stupid and won't mess with us since we clean up the beaches and other things, like save drowning swimmers and help stranded boaters. Depending on who you talk to at the offices and the day of the week you get a different answer.
At one point they (NDOW website) even said that affordable kits exist to make our skis legal. Somebody asked where they got the info as no such thing exists and they realized they were horns-waggled on things they were told about the ban and skis, including the pollution aspect. These guys honestly believed we polluted something like 40% of our fuel unburned through the exhaust. Yep the ban is all built on lies.
The Rangers and NPS are spread super thin as it is too. Last year riding once or twice a week from March to November I saw a Ranger twice. Saw NPS a few times, but the old guy likes us and would cruise by our spot just to BS with us and let us know he won't bother kicking us out after the ban. I know on the weekends at our spot the riders saw the rangers a few times but I don't ride on weekends. Their was something mentioned that 30k (or some other ridiculous number) 2-stroke pwc were registered in Clark County alone. Take that at $20 a ski (actually more with annual lake pass and new quagga fee) plus the tow vehicles annual passes and they are losing more money and being able to staff less people.
Also most Rangers were not very knowledgeable about skis as it was, how they are going to train all these people is beyond me. Not to mention they cannot stop you from entering the lake with a ski.
makejetskiinggreatagain
Brandon
ya same here. i dont know where you're from but if they start these bans on even one or two lakes in colorado im totally screwed. lol this place is already drying up.