Custom/Hybrid 701 powered X2

[Just4Fun]

@Vumad do you know if the 650sx reduction and exit nozzle will fit the x2 pump? I kinda wanna ditch the trim for now.

 

[eastcoastjumper]

@Vumad do you know if the 650sx reduction and exit nozzle will fit the x2 pump? I kinda wanna ditch the trim for now.

Yeah it's the same pump


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[Vumad]

@Vumad do you know if the 650sx reduction and exit nozzle will fit the x2 pump? I kinda wanna ditch the trim for now.

Yes, but it chnges the location of your steering cable. It moves it forward about a inch. You may be ble to adjust it out, but probably not. Give it a shot.

There are a few good options. Make an adapter to move the ball back. I did this with a pjs nozzle using 2 aluminum plates on either side of the nozzle arm that bolted all together and moved the mounting point dor the ball. I dont have a picture.

The other, easier solution, is to make a plate the holds the trim nozzle in place. Iuse a bent plate that bolts to the nozzle mount and the mount for the trim ball.

This is of course assumijg you removed the stock trim control.

Honestly, im lazy. I just let the nozzle flop. There is so much force back there that the trim nozzle is always straight.

You might want to measure the reduction nozzles as well. I think the x2 nozzle is 83mm. The sxr nozzle i think is 81mm. Im not sure what the 650sx nozzle is. My pjs nozzle was 87mm which completely changed the way my pump worked.

 

[Just4Fun]

Yes, but it chnges the location of your steering cable. It moves it forward about a inch. You may be ble to adjust it out, but probably not.

There are a few good options. Make an adapter to move the ball back. I did this with a pjs nozzle using 2 aluminum plates on either side of the nozzle arm that bolted all together and moved the mounting point dor the ball. I dont have a picture.

The other, easier solution, is to make a plate the holds the trim nozzle in place. Iuse a bent plate that bolts to the nozzle mount and the mount for the trim ball.

This is of course assumijg you removed the stock trim control.

Honestly, im lazy. I just let the nozzle flop. There is so much force back there that the trim nozzle is always straight.

Sweet I to am lazy and I will let the nozzle be floppy for now!!

 

[cudaben]

where the oil fill is, i made into my yamaha flush spot. and the trim knob was removed and i made a ss plate to hold the primer. Looking god man.

 

[Just4Fun]

Well i guess i didn't install enough yamaha into my kawi..
Pump bearings are toasted, I rode for about 5 mins and the vibration was so bad I just put back on the trailer and went home. The good news ls the ski ripped not tuned and with a shot pump. it's gonna be fun once it's dialed!!!

 

[Just4Fun]

So I pulled the pump and the bearings feel fine. Yesterday I would rev it up out of water and when I let off the pump would shake and rattle. I could also turn it over by hand and the prop would scrape the wear ring .
What else will cause heavy vibration bad engine alignment? I almost think the driveline is bent.. kawi life

 

[Vumad]

So I pulled the pump and the bearings feel fine. Yesterday I would rev it up out of water and when I let off the pump would shake and rattle. I could also turn it over by hand and the prop would scrape the wear ring .
What else will cause heavy vibration bad engine alignment? I almost think the driveline is bent.. kawi life

You can try rolling the drive shaft like a pool and to see if it's bent. Is the prop tight to the pump housing? No front to back movement? Is the through hull bearing good. Do you have all of your motor mounts and adapter plates bolted down properly. Check pump alignment and coupler alignment. I put stuff together for a long time without aligning it. I believe it takes a fair amount of misalignment to cause heavy vibration.

 

[Just4Fun]

You can try rolling the drive shaft like a pool and to see if it's bent. Is the prop tight to the pump housing? No front to back movement? Is the through hull bearing good. Do you have all of your motor mounts and adapter plates bolted down properly. Check pump alignment and coupler alignment. I put stuff together for a long time without aligning it. I believe it takes a fair amount of misalignment to cause heavy vibration.

Ok so I had a buddy turn the shaft while engaged to the motor it's straight. I fired the motor without the shaft and it's vibrating/rattling like crazy.
So I got the cylinder from my buddy. He had a vibration in his motor so we disassembled it and never really found anything wrong, he just got another motor. The crazy thing is it sounds like his did is it possible for a cylinder to have a loose sleeve or something like that?
Mind blown!!

 

[Vumad]

Ok so I had a buddy turn the shaft while engaged to the motor it's straight. I fired the motor without the shaft and it's vibrating/rattling like crazy.
So I got the cylinder from my buddy. He had a vibration in his motor so we disassembled it and never really found anything wrong, he just got another motor. The crazy thing is it sounds like his did is it possible for a cylinder to have a loose sleeve or something like that?
Mind blown!!

Could have a bad crank. Turn the motor to top dead center, then slightly past that so the pistion is just starting the down stroke. This motion is pulling the piston away from the crank. Hold the crank tight with your hand so it can not spin. Use a screw driver (the blunter the better), or a punch, or some other firm objecy with the least point. Use this to push down on the piston, but not hard enough to score the piston. If the piston moves downward, its a strobg sign you crank is bad.

This is not a difinitive test. It only tests the rod bearing, and its not an absolute test positive or negative. Its just a test that can be done for free without disassembly.

 

[Just4Fun]

Could have a bad crank. Turn the motor to top dead center, then slightly past that so the pistion is just starting the down stroke. This motion is pulling the piston away from the crank. Hold the crank tight with your hand so it can not spin. Use a screw driver (the blunter the better), or a punch, or some other firm objecy with the least point. Use this to push down on the piston, but not hard enough to score the piston. If the piston moves downward, its a strobg sign you crank is bad.

This is not a difinitive test. It only tests the rod bearing, and its not an absolute test positive or negative. Its just a test that can be done for free without disassembly.

I doubt it's the crank, I rode the raider around for an hour before I pulled the motor only thing I changed was jetting and the cylinder. The crank felt great when I had it apart..
This is exactly how my buddy's engine sounded before we pulled it apart, I just don't understand how a cylinder can be bad.

Thanks for the help

 

[cudaben]

THAT is exactly how mine IS. A stock 62t 701. You will probably have to order the shorter Rhaas mounts. I have not yet done it myself, but robin said he made the shorter mounts for a few reasons. One being height issues and vibrations.

I blew apart 2 pumps last season, After the first one I was hoping it was pump - motor alignment issues. It was not.
The first pump was a rebuilt 750 pump that ended up shearing off the pump shaft at the threads and this allowed the modified SXR prop to still spin attached to the driveshaft splines and beat the heck out of the pump, and destroy the prop.

I swapped out the 750 pump with a 650 pump and did the best alignment I could do. Also swapped in a known good x2 driveshaft.
Still vibrates bad and ate up a new c75 9/17 large hub prop... next thing I will try will be the shorter mounts.

This also was like this with my 64x 760, stock and rebuilt, new top end and new crank- swapped out engine plates too. So essentially 3 engines did the same thing.

My 760 never ran right after the rebuild, so i tossed in a tired big pin. Used stock kawi engine mounts, smooth as silk.

Over on PWCtoday more than a few people had similar issues with their yamaha swaps.

The bottom end is so much better than any 750 combo I have ridden- so I guess it is worth it.

 

[Just4Fun]

THAT is exactly how mine IS. A stock 62t 701. You will probably have to order the shorter Rhaas mounts. I have not yet done it myself, but robin said he made the shorter mounts for a few reasons. One being height issues and vibrations.

I blew apart 2 pumps last season, After the first one I was hoping it was pump - motor alignment issues. It was not.
The first pump was a rebuilt 750 pump that ended up shearing off the pump shaft at the threads and this allowed the modified SXR prop to still spin attached to the driveshaft splines and beat the heck out of the pump, and destroy the prop.

I swapped out the 750 pump with a 650 pump and did the best alignment I could do. Also swapped in a known good x2 driveshaft.
Still vibrates bad and ate up a new c75 9/17 large hub prop... next thing I will try will be the shorter mounts.

This also was like this with my 64x 760, stock and rebuilt, new top end and new crank- swapped out engine plates too. So essentially 3 engines did the same thing.

My 760 never ran right after the rebuild, so i tossed in a tired big pin. Used stock kawi engine mounts, smooth as silk.

Over on PWCtoday more than a few people had similar issues with their yamaha swaps.

The bottom end is so much better than any 750 combo I have ridden- so I guess it is worth it.

The alignment on my pump was pretty good, I have since pulled my pump and slid the driveshaft back and still have a horrible vibration. I ve ran the rhaas mounts in my sj and never had a vibration problem. I am 90% sure it is the cylinder so im gonna get a new cylinder and go from there at worst I will have a spare top end..

 

[cudaben]

keep us posted- i was for sure it was the mounts.

 

[Fatman]

THAT is exactly how mine IS. A stock 62t 701. You will probably have to order the shorter Rhaas mounts. I have not yet done it myself, but robin said he made the shorter mounts for a few reasons. One being height issues and vibrations.

I blew apart 2 pumps last season, After the first one I was hoping it was pump - motor alignment issues. It was not.
The first pump was a rebuilt 750 pump that ended up shearing off the pump shaft at the threads and this allowed the modified SXR prop to still spin attached to the driveshaft splines and beat the heck out of the pump, and destroy the prop.

I swapped out the 750 pump with a 650 pump and did the best alignment I could do. Also swapped in a known good x2 driveshaft.
Still vibrates bad and ate up a new c75 9/17 large hub prop... next thing I will try will be the shorter mounts.

This also was like this with my 64x 760, stock and rebuilt, new top end and new crank- swapped out engine plates too. So essentially 3 engines did the same thing.

My 760 never ran right after the rebuild, so i tossed in a tired big pin. Used stock kawi engine mounts, smooth as silk.

Over on PWCtoday more than a few people had similar issues with their yamaha swaps.

The bottom end is so much better than any 750 combo I have ridden- so I guess it is worth it.

This is good to know. In the process of doing the conversion, and will be a little PO'd if the mounts cause an issue. Thanks for the info.

 

[Just4Fun]

@cudaben How long ago did you do your conversion and what kit did you use? I thought the rhaas kits comes with the appropriate height mounts they should be like a 1/4" shorter than oem..

 

[Vumad]

This is good to know. In the process of doing the conversion, and will be a little PO'd if the mounts cause an issue. Thanks for the info.

I'm sure it's not the mounts. I switched oem Superjet mounts for Rhaas rec mounts and had no changes in vibration. Superjet motors vibrate a lot near idle, but not enough to blow out pump bearings. The kit mounts are lower profile than stock mounts because of the adapter plates. I would presume, that if anything, it would transfer more of that vibration into the hull, rather than into the driveline. I can't say that for certain. I don't have the adapter mounts on anything, just stock replica rec mounts.

The Yamaha midshaft could have more dampening, but if it dampened that much, you'd think the Yamaha driveline would get out out alignment a lot.

 

[cudaben]

I spoke to Robin Haas late last year or early this year about my issues I had encountered.
I had in my possession at that time my 2nd rhaas conversion kit. At that time he was offering lowered mounts, but if you did not specify- you received stock height mounts.

He originally did not make shorter mounts, so if you add the conversion plate (1/4") and tall mounts some people (myself included) would have to hog out the kawasaki thru hull bearing support bolt holes to allow for enough upward movement to not bind the driveshaft. My thru hull bolt holes were elongated by about 3/8"s to get the driveshaft to not bind on it. Robin told me this is why he started making the shorter mounts to correct this. (I was a bit surprised he didn't offer me a discount on short set of mounts if I sent mine back in since i was having such troubles )

Last night I was a bit tired and didn't want to type out my whole theory and all the back log between Robin and myself.

My thoughts are taller mounts causing minor binding of the driveshaft, and less than perfect coupler alignment at the bottom causes some vibrations from idle through about 2000 rpms. It can be something horrific, my buddy tried my ski and thought it was about to explode. Since Rhaas mounts are stiffer than OEM more of the vibration is transmitted into the hull and through the driveshaft into the pump.

My pump bearings did not fail- which is a bit strange they seem tight still... I even had the local jet ski mechanic take a look at this and he was a bit confused by it all too. I had bought the bearings through him, and they were not a cheapy chinese kit.

No 2 of these skis are the same, so no 2 of the problems are the same. This is just my experience. Good luck man.

 

[Vumad]

I spoke to Robin Haas late last year or early this year about my issues I had encountered.
I had in my possession at that time my 2nd rhaas conversion kit. At that time he was offering lowered mounts, but if you did not specify- you received stock height mounts.

He originally did not make shorter mounts, so if you add the conversion plate (1/4") and tall mounts some people (myself included) would have to hog out the kawasaki thru hull bearing support bolt holes to allow for enough upward movement to not bind the driveshaft. My thru hull bolt holes were elongated by about 3/8"s to get the driveshaft to not bind on it. Robin told me this is why he started making the shorter mounts to correct this. (I was a bit surprised he didn't offer me a discount on short set of mounts if I sent mine back in since i was having such troubles )

Last night I was a bit tired and didn't want to type out my whole theory and all the back log between Robin and myself.

My thoughts are taller mounts causing minor binding of the driveshaft, and less than perfect coupler alignment at the bottom causes some vibrations from idle through about 2000 rpms. It can be something horrific, my buddy tried my ski and thought it was about to explode. Since Rhaas mounts are stiffer than OEM more of the vibration is transmitted into the hull and through the driveshaft into the pump.

My pump bearings did not fail- which is a bit strange they seem tight still... I even had the local jet ski mechanic take a look at this and he was a bit confused by it all too. I had bought the bearings through him, and they were not a cheapy chinese kit.

No 2 of these skis are the same, so no 2 of the problems are the same. This is just my experience. Good luck man.

I didn't realize the mounts were stock height. I thought the mounts were shorter by the thickness of the adapter plates. The could definitely cause and explain some serious alignment issues.

 

[Just4Fun]

I didn't realize the mounts were stock height. I thought the mounts were shorter by the thickness of the adapter plates. The could definitely cause and explain some serious alignment issues.

I believe the mounts you receive with your kit now like the ones I received are 1/4" lower to compensate for the adapter plates. My motor alignment is pretty spot on only a couple shims needed and the motor coupler slides easily into the driveshaft.. if uou look on there website it says "special height mounts"