Differences Between Yamabond Compounds

[brapperdoodle]

I’ve always used Hondabond in the past, but because I’m building a Yamaha engine I decided to grab a tube of Yamabond. I’m sure it’s probably about the same stuff and it’s not expensive. I did notice though that Yamaha has a few different Yamabond 4 mixtures. I grabbed the Motorsport and Marine versions. The packaging is almost the same, but lists some different ingredients. I can’t find much information about the difference for uses of these compounds. I would assume use the Motorsport for the engine and Marine for pump assembly? Just wondering what you all have to say

 

[catpower]

Not to thread jack but I was getting ready to post this question. So many use the 1211 threebond. I dont know why imo because it is not near as creamy as yamabond, It dries out in the tube or at least looks that way. It comes out thicker. Almost cottage cheese like. I'll say this its not as stringy like others. I like Permatex it's very much like yamabond. I use a red wire nut drill small hole in nut. screw nut on tube and lay a nice small bead. Good info on salt water. I'm dealing with fresh only. cheers.

 

[mikidymac]

Not to thread jack but I was getting ready to post this question. So many use the 1211 threebond. I dont know why imo because it is not near as creamy as yamabond, It dries out in the tube or at least looks that way. It comes out thicker. Almost cottage cheese like. I'll say this its not as stringy like others. I like Permatex it's very much like yamabond. I use a red wire nut drill small hole in nut. screw nut on tube and lay a nice small bead. Good info on salt water. I'm dealing with fresh only. cheers.

That's because Threebond 1211 is not equivalent to Yamabond 4 or the Hondabond.
Threebond 1184 is the same as the Yama Honda and Motoseal and what I have always used on cases. Not sure why so many use 1211 on cases but a lot of top builders do.

 

[Quinc]

Not sure why so many use 1211 on cases but a lot of top builders do.

What my local honda shop said about 1211; "We use the cheaper stuff, but the pro/race builders use 1211."

 

[Carrera911]

I’m putting my motor together soon and I have hondabond 4 (1184) and 1211 on hand. The hondabond seems easier to work with, any real benefit to using 1211? Any thoughts on using either on the exhaust / flywheel cover gaskets? I put them in dry last year and didn’t have any leaks, just curious on what’s standard practice. What about sealing the stator wire plug? Seems like that’s the most likely place for water intrusion, especially with 20 year old rubber.


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[brapperdoodle]

I’m putting my motor together soon and I have hondabond 4 (1184) and 1211 on hand. The hondabond seems easier to work with, any real benefit to using 1211? Any thoughts on using either on the exhaust / flywheel cover gaskets? I put them in dry last year and didn’t have any leaks, just curious on what’s standard practice. What about sealing the stator wire plug? Seems like that’s the most likely place for water intrusion, especially with 20 year old rubber.


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That’s a good question, I’m literally assembling my motor right now...

 

[mikidymac]

All gaskets go on dry from the factory.
You should also be pressure testing any engine that has been apart for air leaks.

 

[Quinc]

I have used 1211 on multiple 701 and 1100 builds. Haven't had any issues with air leaks as of yet. I also put it on the base gasket.

 

[Wetbuffalo]

My two pennies is that 1211 is a lot easier to clean off of cases then hondabond. So pro builders that pull down motors at least every other year use what is easier to clean off.

 

[Roseand]

Last year I used hondabond because it was cheap, and I wiped it off the cases and bought a tube of 1211. I find it way easier to work with especially on a motor where the cases are ported thin leaving minimal sealing space for the base gasket. You don't want it to run off (I found hondabond easy to run, and never found 1211 to be like cottage cheese like the above member had) and you only want a tiny tiny bit and the 1211 is thicker and you can apply a tiny bead and stretch it a long way. Easier and more predictable to work with IMO!

 

[mikidymac]

For the 1184/yamabond you want to use a really thin layer on both side of the cases with full coverage then assemble before it drys. It will be stringy and I use medical sticks, think long toothpicks to spread it perfectly even.

1184/yamabond is not to be used on any gaskets, it is strictly for metal to metal sealing.

1211 will get clumpy like cottage cheese if it gets old or exposed to air from a bad cap which the caps break easily.

 

[catpower]

1211 will get clumpy like cottage cheese if it gets old or exposed to air from a bad cap which the caps break easily.[/QUOTE]

Yes, acts like it seperates out. I've never seen that with other bonds. Even when the tube cracks and starts running out. Think of creamy vs chunky. I'm trusting creamy over chunky for a very thin even layer. I would agree the 1211 comes off easier probably because it is not as thin of bond. Think of water vs ice cubes as a comparison to molecules to gasket sealant under a microscope. Which has more surface contact and which will be easier to remove. To each there own but I'm not sold.

 

[mikidymac]

Just to beat the dead horse......
Take a look at the MSDS sheets for both 1211 and 1184.

1211 is a RTV silicone gasket made for general sealing and electrical insulation. Temp range -76 to 480 degrees F.
It shows a -20.2% of its weight when exposed to gasoline for 24 hours.

1184 is a synthetic rubber specifically made for bonding surfaces with poor flatness and large clearances, resistance to vibration and impact and excellent resistance to water, oil and gasoline.
Temp range -40 to 302 degrees F.
It shows a -2.8% of its weight when exposed to gasoline for 24 hours.

I prefer to use 1184 on cases as it is specifically intended for this purpose and is so much more gasoline and oil resistant than 1211. I use 1211 on everything else. I will say I have been using this combo since the early 1990's and never had an air leak. I only build rec engines and never pull them apart like race engines so I don't know if maybe 1211 is used on race engines because it is easier for constant disassembly.
I do know that Harry at Group K used to use 1211 on his cases and I trust him on everything but I prefer 1184 so to each his own.

 

[yurkanip]

Just to beat the dead horse......
Take a look at the MSDS sheets for both 1211 and 1184.

1211 is a RTV silicone gasket made for general sealing and electrical insulation. Temp range -76 to 480 degrees F.
It shows a -20.2% of its weight when exposed to gasoline for 24 hours.

1184 is a synthetic rubber specifically made for bonding surfaces with poor flatness and large clearances, resistance to vibration and impact and excellent resistance to water, oil and gasoline.
Temp range -40 to 302 degrees F.
It shows a -2.8% of its weight when exposed to gasoline for 24 hours.

I prefer to use 1184 on cases as it is specifically intended for this purpose and is so much more gasoline and oil resistant than 1211. I use 1211 on everything else. I will say I have been using this combo since the early 1990's and never had an air leak. I only build rec engines and never pull them apart like race engines so I don't know if maybe 1211 is used on race engines because it is easier for constant disassembly.
I do know that Harry at Group K used to use 1211 on his cases and I trust him on everything but I prefer 1184 so to each his own.

Bingo, I agree with you on your statement. I have had two motors that formed a leak on the intake side when sealed with 1211. I switched to 1184/hondabond years ago and have never had a leak, and seals so well that when it's time for a rebuild its a pain to separate cases. There is probably some merit to what you say about using 1211 on race/comp motors that might be torn down more often than say a surf motor. 1211 is easier to clean up, and scrape with a razor. I am ocd when building a motor, and i usually mask the sides of the cases with painters tape prior to installing the 1184, then once case halves are joined I simply pull off the tape and no mess to wipe off.