Differences in Carbon Fiber Quality

[naticen]

US Composites has 5.7oz x 50 inch wide , 2x2 Twill Weave Carbon Fiber for sale in the discount section for $27.50 a yard and then again as 1st Quality in the regular section for $41.50. Then an ebay seller has what looks like the same one for $22.00 shipped.

I'm not concerned about looks or a minute difference in strength. I just want to lay one layer inside my ski for a little insurance and lightweight reinforcement. Will I notice a difference in any of these cloths?

 

[Roseand]

From what I understand, glass is the best for reinforcement because it will flex with the hull though. Tom21 explained that to me.

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[naticen]

I sent him a PM as well considering it is his hull. The hull is glass and that does make sense, but it is so lightweight right now and I want to keep it that way. It just has a little more flex than I am comfortable with.

My FX just got a ton of new stress cracks from Daytona this year and I don't want to risk a fancy hull. The FX has a layer of glass inside, but I think that the original bottom is about gone from being beached for 20 years. I'm also good at lawn darts and getting too deep surfing little waves.

 

[Roseand]

You won't save a substantial amount of weight with carbon unless you vacuum bag it.

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[naticen]

I've never used carbon. I already have an ishload of different glass cloth so I guess it would might be smart to go that route.

 

[Roseand]

You'd be amazed at how much strength one layer of 1208 biax adds. If you want to keep it as light weight as possible; do this.
After you get your template cut out and your glass cut, grab a piece of cardboard. Set your glass on there, and put your resin on it. Dab all of the corners real good with extra resin, and work it through. Makes it easy to wet out the corners this way. Especially when you spread the excess resin out over the edges. You can use as much resin as you want, but then you can squeegee all of the excess out very easily, and get it very lightweight. Makes it pretty darn easy, and it isn't that heavy.
That's more beneficial for heavier cloths though, but it keeps the weight down. 1208 is worth the strength..

Edit: Maybe this is all review for you, but I don't know your glassing experience. Also, tom21 showed me this scissors, and it makes glass work so much easier. It's an amazing scissors.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Fiskars-4-25-in-Titanium-Shop-Shears-12-96536984/100098789

 

[naticen]

That's what I usually use for reinforcement, but that cardboard tip is a good idea. I always end up with to much resin pooling in the strakes or wherever I am laying it.

 

[Roseand]

Do you use a squeegee?

A fiberglass roller works wonders for getting air bubbles out and stuff too..

 

[naticen]

I do all of that. I'm just impatient and by the time I get it wet out, I've got too much resin and it leaves a little pools in the low spots. I can and will do better on this hull, I just was thinking why not step up even more and use some carbon.

 

[DAG]

Pretty boys use carbon

 

[naticen]

I'm pretty

 

[Roseand]

I'm tempted to try out some of that plain weave carbon that us composites has with the kevlar tracer for 16$ a yard..For building a tray, I'd want the extra rigidity.

 

[tom21]

I wouldnt put carbon in it. they are different materials and have different properties. I would bond it and use the bonding adhesive to fair the inside edge and outside edge. then lay some thin glass over the joint inside and out. also if you get a chance will you please weight the bottom once you have all the good installed? in my haste to finish and get on the road I forgot to weight it. I would like to know what all the inserts and resin added in weight. if not I will get it from the next one. Im guessin that all together you will add 10lbs or less(hopefully). stock is 80. stock plus all the mods was 120 and the carbon one is 60. im estimating this at 60-65lbs.

 

[Brian_216]

Www.sollercomposites.com anywhere else and you are paying way too much. Soller weaves their own carbon, they buy bulk of tow strands and make what they sell. 20% cheaper in most cases. As far as wetting out material- get a roll of heavy plastic in the paint department at lowes etc. Cover a table with it and clamp the edges tight. Wet out your material on that. Flip and wet both sides, try to get all the excess off with the squeegee on each side. If you get it too dry you may have issues getting it to stick. Always good to brush a thin coat on the part you will be putting it on.

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[Balduccimoto]

Thanks for that website, that is some cheap carbon i'll give them a shot next time.

I am no expert at carbon fiber, but I just recently did a wet lay up on a tray this week so i'll make some comments on my experience. I used a 19.7oz 2x2 from US Composites and it's thick stuff. The weave wanted to fall apart when I cut my template. A little masking tape on the edges was good to hold it together while I wet it out on the bench and put it on the hull where I pulled off the wet tape. Wetting out is a little harder to see than glass, I did it on the bench with some brown shipping paper beneath and pressed it in with a brush. When it was on the tray I really messed up and distorted the weave trying to push the excess resin out with a bondo spreader.

It helped me alot to weigh the fabric first then match the resin weight to the fabric (50-50 and then some extra). For first time wetting out carbon fiber it definately helped get a feel with how much resin.

I would recommend using 1708 biaxial mat, it has become the standard here for good reason. I feel like for proper carbon fiber reinforcement would require 2 layers as opposed to 1 of 1708. Carbon fiber doesn't have good torsional(?) properties which is why you see in lay ups people do 2 carbon fiber layers, one at 0° and another at 45°. I understood this property by taking a piece of carbon fiber and pull it apart in different directions. At 0° you can pull it diagonally but not horizontally. At 45° it is reversed. If you hold biaxial mat with 2 hands, it doesnt have much pull in any direction. (Am I on point?)

If you are dead set on carbon fiber, I would do some practice runs first.

 

[Brian_216]

Using tape on the carbon is the way to do it. And to know when its wet enough the tape will turn color and start to fall off if your using white masking tape. It keeps it from falling apart when you are working with it.

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[Schmidty721]

I used sollercomposites to source all of my carbon as well.

I'll say one thing, if you've never worked with carbon your going to find out really quick it's hard to make it look good.
It'll teach you some appreciation for the guys who can lay the stuff and make it look nice. 5.7oz is a cosmetic weave IMO. Too light for any real structural gains. You need to be in the 12-19oz range to make it worth while.