Lithium batteries

Agree with everything but this ^^

LiFe cells have a virtually flat discharge curve, meaning the voltage is roughly the same from the time they come off the charger until they are dead. This is a huge advantage for TL users, as the usable battery voltage is always above 13 V.

>> Absolutely correct and agreed , if they hold the charge properly or are not over charged <> undercharged, what I meant to say is that the lithium batteries we utilized in the past did not hold this charge /discharge properly and we had significant loss in performance compared to the standard battery we ran all last season ( charged and discharged a million of times still running strong ) .

In general I am not against lithium batteries, our ski caught fire , we had bad experiences overall with lithium batteries, 2 bubbled, 2 broke , 1 caught fire , a deka was in-between too .in conjunction with the price tag it was not user-friendly for us and not worth the weight savings ....
 

bondra131

Thaat's braptaastic!
It can't lean AS bad though and you're still ditching 10 pounds off of the far right side. I'm sure the ski would feel different... Just sounded nice to me that's all

I am sorry but I think you and your friend are miss informed.

Its not a magical fire, its water intrusion thru the outer box, shortening of the battery, or defective cheap Chinese crap inside the battery..

Loosing $ 30K over 10 pounds ....nah, its not worth it .

You are comparing a stock SJ with aftermarket hulls.....

What if the ski lights up in your garage at home ? Or on the trailer locked up for the night with other skis and your gas jugs....

If you run total loss with lithium you would know that your skis runs weaker and weaker thru out the day.....

So take the battery out of your SJ....oh doh still leans wonder why ??? Exhaust tube ding ding
 

bondra131

Thaat's braptaastic!
Yea, exactly... Battery failures are RARE. Use them properly. Keep your grounds and powers clean and your bartery charged. Should never have a ski lighting up on fire lol

First of all I am not a fan of running the ETX 9. It is one third of the CCA of the stock battery. You will typically run into problems with extended cranking or big cc, big compression motors with it.

Now, as far as the total loss goes, keep in mind that lead acid batteries, including AGM, are not designed to be rundown and recharged repeatedly. This greatly reduces their life and their performance. In addition as they run down over the course of the day, they lose voltage and thus your ignition, starter, and all other electrical equipment will gradually run on lower voltage and thus be required to consume higher current to do the same amount of work. (W=VA). If you lose volts, you need amps to make it up.

Lithium batteries, on the other hand, are designed to be rundown and recharged multiple times. If you look for the data sheets on the particular cells in your LiFe battery, you will find the cycle life is rated in the thousands. This means that they are well-suited for the constant running down in recharging that we subject into with total loss.

However, the only catch is that they are very sensitive to being over discharged (meaning run down too low), and are subject to irreversible damage if this occurs. This is the reason that most companies do not want to warranty them for total loss, as they fear that they will be run down below the minimum operating voltage, thus causing cell damage to the battery, which is not covered under warranty.

To answer your question about the voltage specifically, the life cells that we use maintain a constant voltage around 13.2 to 13.3 V, from fully charged to almost fully discharged. This means that our electronics see the same 13.2 V for the course of a riding day. The fact that it remains at 13.2 rather than 12.4 to 12.6 like an AGM, means that we will have slightly improved ignition and starter performance due to the higher voltage. This higher voltage also means reduced current to the starter and start relay, meaning easier starting and hopefully longer starter and starter relay life.

Once again the biggest issues/benefits are seen on the bigger CC motors with high compression.

I've been selling battery kits and ignition kits to customers for years with few to no issues. This is because I sell proper chargers, spec the right battery for the application, and do some additional waterproofing on the cells to be sure that they do not get water damage. I run the same stuff in my personal boats, and in all the competition boats that I sponsor and build. I only sell what I use myself and what I truly believe is the best product. However, as previously mentioned, most issues are customer use/care. Battery failures are rare. Impact damage, water intrusion, and improper charging/operation is far more common, and not the batteries fault.
 

bondra131

Thaat's braptaastic!
That's interesting... I've never heard of that one. I will never run total loss. Stock lightened flywheel all the way. I might look into that. Sounds like they need charged too frequently enough?

I've been lurking on this thread and others like it for the last few years. When I set out to build my ski last year, the entire goal was to keep everything as light as possible. I tried a life battery in my last ski and it lasted half a summer before the internals got wet and started dropping cells. I did some research and ended up going a different route than what has been discussed on the X. I am actually running a bank of 12 300 farad ultracapacitors in small enclosure that weights less than 3 lbs and has about 600cca. The advantage is that you can completely discharge and recharge them over 1 million times with no performance loss, as well as quick charge the pack with any charger from dead to full in about 2 minutes. The disadvantage is that there isn't a lot of stored current so you get about 10-12, 3 second cranks before the voltage is too low to start your ski. This will not be a good choice for a TL set-up, but has been working fine for my lightened charging system and no bilge pumps. These capacitors are sealed themselves so they can be submerged with no issues. Keeping water from corroding the connections is the only concern. I completely packed my enclosure with dielectric grease during assembly and haven't had any problems. I've been reluctant to post, as I didn't want to stir up a bunch of controversy, but figured I'd share my way around a 10lb battery. ;)
 
I've been running a Shorai lithium battery in my SJ and 550sx for almost three years and no problems. After riding I connect to Shorai charger and it tops the battery off in under 5 minutes.
 
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