Need advice on CO2 trim.

[WaveDemon]

I want to convert my pull trim to a CO2 actuated trim. I’ve got access to a paint ball CO2 container and regulator. What do I need to activate it? Any ideas or advice welcome. :afro:

 

[RoyalFlush@PCB]

I want to convert my pull trim to a CO2 actuated trim. I’ve got access to a paint ball CO2 container and regulator. What do I need to activate it? Any ideas or advice welcome. :afro:

PM parrdaddy---he was working on something similar but with compressed air if I remember correctly.

I didn't even realize you had a trim setup, Tim. :dunno:

 

[dbrutherford]

I was searching for pneumatic linear actuators but wasn't finding much. I am going to ask a few engineers here at my factory if they have any catalogues or companies in mind.

I remember RPOT sold a hydraulic trim system. It just used a magura lever. Not too sure where you would get the slave cylinder from. There used to be hydraulic clutch conversion kits for dirt bikes.

I like idea of CO2 over a lever too

 

[Ollie Rastabean]

12 V solenoid valve. the ones used for airide setups are bigger then needed but plentiful + cheap.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1-2-...017QQitemZ270165138594QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD7V

Good Old bimba cylinder. This one is only 2" travel but might work. CHEEP!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/8-3-...ryZ33736QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

-O

 

[SuperJETT]

yep, bimba cylinders. I have one in the garage I was toying with for a sunroof actuator on my Element. You can have it if I can still find it. I think it was 2.5" travel with dual rods and maybe 1" bore.

Just look on Ebay for the stroke you need and small bore. Using CO2 will give you plenty of power. We can do some calculations on the pressure/bore you'll need.

Figure 1000 lbs thrust, and 30 degrees of trim, you'd need 500 lbs force to pull it. Paintball canisters are around 800psi I think, so 1 sq in of piston area would handle that easily.

I played with my cylinder with just 5 psi and it was going to be plenty for what I needed.

 

[SuperJETT]

http://cgi.ebay.com/BRAND-NEW-BIMBA...ryZ67010QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[Mark44]

www.bimba.com I use this all the time.

Purchase them from www.jhf.com Bimba cylinders do not cost much and you probably want one that is normally extended.

Mark44

 

[SuperJETT]

BTW, I like the Flat-1 or 2 cylinders, very compact.

 

[Ollie Rastabean]

yep, bimba cylinders. I have one in the garage I was toying with for a sunroof actuator on my Element. You can have it if I can still find it. I think it was 2.5" travel with dual rods and maybe 1" bore.

Just look on Ebay for the stroke you need and small bore. Using CO2 will give you plenty of power. We can do some calculations on the pressure/bore you'll need.

Figure 1000 lbs thrust, and 30 degrees of trim, you'd need 500 lbs force to pull it. Paintball canisters are around 800psi I think, so 1 sq in of piston area would handle that easily.

I played with my cylinder with just 5 psi and it was going to be plenty for what I needed.

I think it would be a better idea to reg down to approx 150 psi for the bimba. That way soft poly line could be used for the plumbing and the valve is resonably inexpensive.

I dont think you need to overcome 500 lbs of force. After all you are just trying to pull the same amount as you do with your hand.

 

[WaveDemon]

I need *some* more force than by hand. That’s the reason I want to upgrade my trim. I want it to activate quickly while under load.

 

[Mark44]

Yes you will need a regulator for sure, a 2" cylinder has a power factor of 3.
I think you will need more of a 9/16" dia. cylinder with a power factor of 0.25
rod normally extended.

Just thinking out loud.

Mark44

 

[Mark44]

p

I need *some* more force than by hand. That’s the reason I want to upgrade my trim. I want it to activate quickly while under load.

O well then that changes things A LOT. Never mind what I said before.

First thing I would do is fire up the ski apply throttle while the ski is held and take a force gauge and push the nozzle up. This will get you in the game real quick and keep the design time at a minimum. McMaster has force gauges pretty cheep.

Again just thinking out loud.

Mark44

 

[WFO Speedracer]

Anyone remember the auto trim setup they came out with years ago,it had a cylinder that worked off of water pressure,you drilled and tapped the exit nozzle for a fitting then ran a hose to the cylinder.The faster you went the more water pressure you got and the higher it trimmed up.When you went into a turn the pump lost pressure and it trimmed down.I tried one out on the Seadoos way back when,it was the simplest most effective trim setup I have ever seen.I realize it wouldn't do what you are trying to do here but it could be modded to do that I think.

 

[SuperJETT]

I think it would be a better idea to reg down to approx 150 psi for the bimba. That way soft poly line could be used for the plumbing and the valve is resonably inexpensive.

I dont think you need to overcome 500 lbs of force. After all you are just trying to pull the same amount as you do with your hand.

I was just tossing out numbers without thinking, thanks for thinking for me. When I was messing around with my cylinder, I was looking at somewhere between 5-10 psi max.

One other note, for what you're wanting to do, you're going to need a strong cable/rod to actuate it.

 

[FLY6584]

Anyone remember the auto trim setup they came out with years ago,it had a cylinder that worked off of water pressure,you drilled and tapped the exit nozzle for a fitting then ran a hose to the cylinder.The faster you went the more water pressure you got and the higher it trimmed up.When you went into a turn the pump lost pressure and it trimmed down.I tried one out on the Seadoos way back when,it was the simplest most effective trim setup I have ever seen.I realize it wouldn't do what you are trying to do here but it could be modded to do that I think.

Thats actually a pretty good idea. There has got to be someway to harness all that pressure and be able to apply it to a trim system like this.

 

[WFO Speedracer]

I was wondering if you could use a hydraulic actuator for this and use water pressure instead of hydraulic pressure.I have seen actuators that come in stainless steel for extreme applications.