ATS_Aaron
X-
- Location
- Shady Shores, TX
Pre-Mix ratios
- Thread starter ATS_Aaron
- Start date
hangtime
Speak up ,don't kiss azz
- Location
- WORCESTER,MASS- HAMPTON N.H.
I can't understand why they would do that .Every single oil I've ever used has dye in it so you can tell it's mixed .
I am certainly not the expert mechanic that my hubby is and I haven't consulted him so probably shouldn't be speaking up. But, from a chemist point of view and knowing that the oil in the gas certainly does burn (hence the blue to the smoke), it has to add something to the combustion mixture.
It may be completely insignificant from a tuner's perspective (again, hubby would know, I don't recall) but I would expect it to add at least very slightly to the richness of the mixture. Gas or oil, it's all long-chain hydrocarbons. Oil is longer chains than the gas, but gets burned during the process of combustion all the same. It has to add at least a tiny bit.
Again, may be insignificant to the tuner and this may be a mute point, but the chemist in me says it adds something.
Chuckie, Jr., you watching? What's your thoughts.
Now I'm curious how significant/insignificant it might be.
Kennay
Squarenose for the _____
- Location
- Myrtle Beach, SC
I've read a few write ups that stated the more oil, the more power... to an extent. I can't seem to find anything on it at the moment. I'd like to hear Chuck or someone like that chime in.
dbrutherford
Parts Whore
- Location
- Fairmont, WV
I always point out that it is only a vapor film that lubricates your crank, cylinder walls, and wrist pin bearing! Engines run on fumes, not liquids....
I usually mix 32:1, 36:1 or 40:1. Most likely 36:1 and I use the Kawasaki TCW3 crap at the local Kawie dealer. Then again I am not running a high end engine with major $$$ put into it at the moment. If that would change, hello Klotz! You can usually get pretty good deals on it at the races from the vendors.
I usually mix 32:1, 36:1 or 40:1. Most likely 36:1 and I use the Kawasaki TCW3 crap at the local Kawie dealer. Then again I am not running a high end engine with major $$$ put into it at the moment. If that would change, hello Klotz! You can usually get pretty good deals on it at the races from the vendors.
Kennay
Squarenose for the _____
- Location
- Myrtle Beach, SC
Big Kahuna
Administrator
- Location
- Tuscaloosa, AL
I have read that at a certain mixture, the oil can help with compression, kinda acts like a temp seal at the rings..........
yamaslut
kill it
- Location
- Daytona Beach, Florida
more oil = more compression, leaner conditions, less octane
it definitely does something...
it definitely does something...
bad93blaster
X-H2
i talk to a kart builder years ago and has said the 32:1 you get the most power. i beleave the they rune the engine lean and depend on the oil to make up for it
i run 40:1 r-50
- Location
- Plymouth, MA
32:1 for me per Judge and Lamey.
Wolf Child
Just Another Octard
- Location
- All over C. FL
the oil doesnt burn. it feeds the crank or gets spit out the exhaust.
- Location
- HOLLAND MA.
32:1 with race fuel is what iv always run,burns perfect,plugs,domes light tan AMSOIL DOMINATOR.
- Location
- HOLLAND MA.
wolf child i laf everytime i see that vidio clip..
WAB
salty nuts
- Location
- coastal GA
Don't quote me, but I remember Chuck recommended the Quicksilver oil. It's just a tcw-3 outboard oil, nothing special that I can remember. Not expensive either.
I mix to about 45:1 of the Penzoil (blend of full synth) found at auto parts places and Wal-Mart.
I mix to about 45:1 of the Penzoil (blend of full synth) found at auto parts places and Wal-Mart.
Big Kahuna
Administrator
- Location
- Tuscaloosa, AL
he did.
Talked to the hubby over lunch. He says there have been multiple studies done (with other 2 stroke engines) that show you get more power the more oil you have in the mixture (up to about 16:1) as long as you keep the fuel/air mixture the same. Apparently, at around 16:1 you are more likely to start fouling plugs.
He went on to explain that because the oil takes up some of the space that fuel molecules would occupy while going through the jet, so, you may have to increase the jet size, with more oil in the mixture, in order to keep the fuel/air ratio the same. This effect will be most noticeable when there is a significant increase in the amount of oil in the mix.
My thoughts: Think of it like marbles trying to get through the jet. Black marbles are fuel. White marbles are air. If there are red marbles (oil) in this mixture, you need a bigger hole to get the same number of black and white marbles through.
He also said (like Lake, wasn't it Lake?) that unless you are running right on the edge of being too lean, you will likely not notice any lean out problems with adding a little more oil to the gas. The extra oil may also somewhat tend to protect the motor against the consequences of being too lean even though it actually may increase the likelihood of detonation.
He has an old chain saw that's close to 60 yrs old, now. His dad used to run it on 1 qt oil per gallon of gas (about 12:1). He says that saw never fouls plugs, never had any problems and runs just as well now as it ever did. It doesn't get heavy use any more, but 60 years old fer cryin' out loud.
Don't know if that helps anybody, but it helped me.
He went on to explain that because the oil takes up some of the space that fuel molecules would occupy while going through the jet, so, you may have to increase the jet size, with more oil in the mixture, in order to keep the fuel/air ratio the same. This effect will be most noticeable when there is a significant increase in the amount of oil in the mix.
My thoughts: Think of it like marbles trying to get through the jet. Black marbles are fuel. White marbles are air. If there are red marbles (oil) in this mixture, you need a bigger hole to get the same number of black and white marbles through.
He also said (like Lake, wasn't it Lake?) that unless you are running right on the edge of being too lean, you will likely not notice any lean out problems with adding a little more oil to the gas. The extra oil may also somewhat tend to protect the motor against the consequences of being too lean even though it actually may increase the likelihood of detonation.
He has an old chain saw that's close to 60 yrs old, now. His dad used to run it on 1 qt oil per gallon of gas (about 12:1). He says that saw never fouls plugs, never had any problems and runs just as well now as it ever did. It doesn't get heavy use any more, but 60 years old fer cryin' out loud.
Don't know if that helps anybody, but it helped me.
The oil certainly does burn, it just doesn't burn as well as the gas. If it wasn't burning, there would not be a blue tinge to 2 stroke exhaust.
It may not all burn, but some of it certainly does.
Wolf Child
Just Another Octard
- Location
- All over C. FL
I'll concede that point to you.
but alot of that excess oil just gets spit out. dont believe me? take a look and any 2T dirtbike exhaust.
Yep, that's why we burn gas, not oil. Oil doesn't burn quickly or efficiently enough.
Mouthfulloflake
ISJWTA member #2
- Location
- NW Arkansas
the difference in burning oil and burning gas is SIMPLE.
gas is explosive, it MAKES the combustion.
the OIL, being in there, is somewhat consumed ( generally not all of it, but some)
but it does not ADD to the combustion, in fact I contend that it is actually parasitic to the combustion process ( all lubing and ring seal properties aside)
Odd Duck, it sounds as if your mechanic agrees with my initial thoughts of rich premix leaning out the carb mixture.
gas is explosive, it MAKES the combustion.
the OIL, being in there, is somewhat consumed ( generally not all of it, but some)
but it does not ADD to the combustion, in fact I contend that it is actually parasitic to the combustion process ( all lubing and ring seal properties aside)
Odd Duck, it sounds as if your mechanic agrees with my initial thoughts of rich premix leaning out the carb mixture.