sbt motorsany good?

[jplutinof]

so i recently blew up a motor in my 1998 sxi pro that i had a top end done on. One of the rod bearings let go. I have 2 options:
1 rebuild with a new crank and pistons and head
2 buy an sbt motor.

Are sbt motors any good? Ive heard good things in the past but nothing really current. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

john

 

[Quinc]

Rebuild. After shipping etc from SBT it will be cheaper and you can use better parts.

 

[jplutinof]

Thx. Kinda what I was thinking though I hear they have a really good warranty.

 

[Quinc]

Thx. Kinda what I was thinking though I hear they have a really good warranty.

Until you have to pay to ship the engine back and then pay to have the new one shipped to you.

 

[jplutinof]

Until you have to pay to ship the engine back and then pay to have the new one shipped to you.

Very true. Think I'll be rebuilding. Lol

 

[WFO Speedracer]

Rebuild it and then you know what you have

 

[jplutinof]

I'll be rebuilding it but I would still like to hear from someone who's actually bought an sbt motor. Curious if they are any good. The place I have work on my stuff said they're crap.

 

[holjen77]

I am willing to bet 90% of us on here have at least some SBT parts on their ski. They might not admit it, but that stuff gets used and generally works fine. Sometimes it's your only option. That being said it's always my last option.

 

[jpswift1]

I'd highly recommend avoiding SBT at all costs. I've seen people that had some VERY bad experiences with their inferior quality products, "rebuilds", and warranty.

 

[WFO Speedracer]

I'll be rebuilding it but I would still like to hear from someone who's actually bought an sbt motor. Curious if they are any good. The place I have work on my stuff said they're crap.

I work on Jet skis for a living and have done so as an independent since 1999, I have bought and installed more SBT engines than most here, I use them as my last option, I have had engines that worked phenomenally well and survived multiple bouts of water ingestion and I have had engines that sounded like death metal as soon as I fired them up and died before the warranty expired. The problem with SBT its like a box of chocolates, you never know what you are going to get, SBT warranty does not cover installation costs and installing their engine almost cost me my business at one point. I strive for perfection , once it leaves I do not want to see it back till something else breaks. Using SBT engines I couldn't live up to that protocol.

Most of the SBT engines I have had to go into that failed were already 1.00 mm oversize on the bore, making it difficult to find pistons to repair them with and anything past 1.00 is over mfgs recommended limits, I know SBT makes 1.5mm oversize pistons for this purpose however on Yamahas the liners get too thin to be reliable, on Seadoos the surface area for sealing the head gets too thin to seal anymore. Yes it can be done but it is not recommended.

I have had decent luck with their crankshafts and so have companies like Jetmaniac who uses SBT cranks in their engine builds. The pistons are low quality IMO , I prefer WSM pistons for low dollar cast pistons or OEM, Protec , Wiseco and Wossner for higher performance usage. SBT's parts are made in China or Thailand, so are most of WSM's parts. I would choose WSM parts over SBT parts any day of the week, their pistons meet very high machining tolerances and I have never had a piston failure that I could attribute to a manafucturing problem with WSM pistons. None of this news about SBT is new or groundbreaking. it is what it is.

 

[Austin_landers]

sbt 750 small pin in sending back for warranty .
Ordered Jan 2020, was told 6-8 weeks . Didn’t receive until end of April. Installed . Ski ran but low on power , shows 105 psi after couple hrs run time . Removed engine and got rough cylinder to piston clearance measurement of .010-.012”.

 

[WFO Speedracer]

I work on Jet skis for a living and have bought and installed more SBT engines than most here, I use them as my last option, I have had engines that worked phenominally well and survived multiple bouts of water ingestion and I have had engines that sounded like death as soon as I fired them up and died before the warranty expired. The problem with SBT its like a box of chocolates, you never know what you are going to get.

Most of the engines I have had to go into that failed were already 1.00 mm oversize on the bore, making it difficult to find pistons to repair them with and anything past 1.00 is over mfgs recommended limits, on Yamahas the liners get too thin to be reliable, on Seadoos the surface area for sealing the head gets too thin to seal anymore.

I have had decent luck with their crankshafts and so have companies like Jetmaniac who uses SBT cranks in their engine builds. The pistons are low quality IMO , I prefer WSM pistons for low dollar cast pistons or OEM, Protec , Wiseco and Wossner for higher performance usage. SBT's parts are made in China or Thailand, so are most of WSM's parts. None of this news about SBT is new or groundbreaking. it is what it is.

View attachment 417435
sbt 750 small pin in sending back for warranty .
Ordered Jan 2020, was told 6-8 weeks . Didn’t receive until end of April. Installed . Ski ran but low on power , shows 105 psi after couple hrs run time . Removed engine and got rough cylinder to piston clearance measurement of .010-.012”.

You do know they don't ALLOW you to open up the engine if you are sending it back for warranty right, I hope they don't try to to get out of fixing their screwup, stuff like this is exactly why I stopped using their engines.

I had a 4tec seadoo I installed the engine on, on the test ride the oil light came on, I checked the oil level and it was super low, turns out the rubber valve cover gasket had split , pretty obvious as oil was all over the head and in the bilge, they wanted me to pull the engine and send it back, It got pretty heated and I told them they were out of their Fing minds, I grabbed a used OEM valve cover gasket , installed it and ran the boat again, then they wanted to say I violated the warranty by replacing a valve cover gasket, what kind of company does poop like this , I just saved them an engine and they wanted to violate my customers warranty , the stuff they do makes no sense, there are many other stories I could tell you here .

The company as a whole does not care about the customer or their reputation, they have moved on to other revenue streams such as Watercraft Superstore, buying out hydroturf and 4xpro their ATV axle company, most people don't know they started out making CV axles for Automobiles before getting into the PWC business.

 

[Vumad]

I have only had a few motors rebuilt. I have used SBT cranks without issues. My skis tend to be rode fairly hard but stay lower hours. My Superjet motor for example only has about 60 hours in about 5 years but it has had salt water ingestion and it has been held WOT a lot of those hours on a bouy course. It runs very well with no noises or indication of issues. I run yamalube 45:1 with ethanol free and sta-bil.

I have never used a SBT top end. My understanding is there top ends have lower tolerances. I tend to use SBT cranks with a bore and Pro-X pistons. I also usually have someone experienced assemble it. I think in total I have only had 2 or 3 motors built and I stay stock in spec.

I think my motors end up a lot like the JetManiac motors. I believe he uses SBT cranks but not SBT pistons. I think that if I were to recommend a complete motor I would suggest a JetManiac rebuild over an SBT swap. I personally do not like the JetManiac freestyle porting, but I am confident that you would get whatever porting you want, which in my case would be stock porting. I can't say that I myself would buy a JetManic motor only because I have a huge amount of local resources in Tampa Bay. There are also other companies that will do a good job rebuilding your motor. JetManiac is not the only option. I only mention JetManiac because he is pretty local and I believe has motors ready to ship.

 

[Austin_landers]

You do know they don't ALLOW you to open up the engine if you are sending it back for warranty right, I hope they don't try to to get out of fixing their screwup, stuff like this is exactly why I stopped using their engines.

I had a 4tec seadoo I installed the engine on, on the test ride the oil light came on, I checked the oil level and it was super low, turns out the rubber valve cover gasket had split , pretty obvious as oil was all over the head and in the bilge, they wanted me to pull the engine and send it back, It got pretty heated and I told them they were out of their Fing minds, I grabbed a used OEM valve cover gasket , installed it and ran the boat again, then they wanted to say I violated the warranty by replacing a valve cover gasket, what kind of company does poop like this , I just saved them an engine and they wanted to violate my customers warranty , the stuff they do makes no sense, there are many other stories I could tell you here .

The company as a whole does not care about the customer or their reputation, they have moved on to other revenue streams such as Watercraft Superstore, buying out hydroturf and 4xpro their ATV axle company, most people don't know they started out making CV axles for Automobiles before getting into the PWC business.

I knew that so I didn’t pull the head . Just was able to get rough measurement through exhaust port . First and last sbt engine I will ever buy .

 

[WFO Speedracer]

You do know they don't ALLOW you to open up the engine if you are sending it back for warranty right, I hope they don't try to to get out of fixing their screwup, stuff like this is exactly why I stopped using their engines.

I knew that so I didn’t pull the head . Just was able to get rough measurement through exhaust port . First and last sbt engine I will ever buy .

good deal

 

[kevbo]

Doesn't Yamaha use SBT garbage for their warranty engines?

 

[jplutinof]

Thanks all for your replies. What about PWC motors? I may use sbt for the crank as mines toast and the recommended place in Idaho wants 550 plus shipping to rebuild mine.

 

[sturat]

Thanks all for your replies. What about PWC motors? I may use sbt for the crank as mines toast and the recommended place in Idaho wants 550 plus shipping to rebuild mine.

competitive does pretty killer work. It's worth every dollar. Speaking from experience, jeff did a great job with my EME crank.

C57 racing is not too far from you and can do your cylinder and maybe fix the head if its that bad. I would recommend them any day of the week!

SBT stands for "Stu Broke This" or "Send back tomorrow".... they used to be good many years ago, then ownership changed, and they started to go downhill. The cylinder exchange program also used to be good, but due to the rotating doors (i know current and former employees, i only live 45 mins away) things have also gone downhill. God forbid you look inside the cylinder and see the chamfer and portmatching of their re-sleeve jobs.

For some things they are great. The big pin we put in my buddy's pro lasted just over 2 years (installed 2 years ago) but he did not ride all that much. The wrist pin just broke loose and destroyed the cylinder this past weekend. The 61x engines they do almost always fail a leakdown test. They seem to be the better of the bunch. 650 kawi engines have lasted pretty well IME. I do not have any experiences with their 440/550 engines.

 

[jplutinof]

Here's a pic of the head.