Ski suddenly running really flat

DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
Completely stumped on this one
Had my 66e 1050 at the lake last week
Starter takes a dump
Bring it home, replace starter
Notice one of my veins is snapped
Assemble new stator and replace in ski with a oem prop spacer this time (none prior)
Get it out to the lake Next week and the ski is running extremely flat
Just no power whatsoever
Motor sounds fine, just won’t rev up
But when I get the pump to unload slightly the motor seems to rev up for a brief second then die back down
Sounds like something is major holding back the motor
Feels like riding a oem 650
Ski keeps running away at idle out of water with no leaking Venturi
I have
-cleaned the carbs, replaced the seat o-rings and needles on both, tried several different pop off pressures
-made sure I had no exhaust obstructions
-new plugs
-verified MSD TL was firing both plugs
-verified my stator plate hasn’t shifted in any way
-tried fresh gas
-verified compression is good
-verified butterflies opening at same time

Ran perfectly fine, sat a week, get it out and it refuses to run right
No changes to jets or anything of the sort
I have considered that it is the prop after spacing it away from the stator but the ski doesn’t vibrate/rev up, no cavitation
Did have the TL system on for a few hours before I remembered to shut it off, but I haven’t seen one go bad without outright refusing to even fire. Have also run same prop with a spacer before and it seemed to be better. Would not rule out a electrical issue.

Any suggestions? Going to do a leak down test again when I get home to rule that out. Seals only have a few hours on them. Can not find anything out of ordinary. Anyone have anything Similar happen?
 
Pro-pulsion

Pro-pulsion

Location
Ontario, Canada
Sounds like a leaking crank seal. It may not be leaking initially but I have seen on my former SD XP800 that with bad crank bearings, on the power stroke there was just enough bearing play to open up an air gap between the crank and seal. It was the same results too that you describe. No power in the water, on the trailer it would somewhat power up but never would it run properly. It never showed that the seals were leaking either in regards to fuel charge being discharged through the seals and building up on the block. It stumped at least 3 BRP techs, they weren't willing to tear it down to find the real source of the problem. I had enough of it and tore it apart myself. My buddy and I discovered the mag side bearing was missing about 3 balls from the cage. Not like they were ejected from a broken cage either, missing as in not a part of the assembly from day one.
 
DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
Pro-pulsion said:
Sounds like a leaking crank seal. It may not be leaking initially but I have seen on my former SD XP800 that with bad crank bearings, on the power stroke there was just enough bearing play to open up an air gap between the crank and seal. It was the same results too that you describe. No power in the water, on the trailer it would somewhat power up but never would it run properly. It never showed that the seals were leaking either in regards to fuel charge being discharged through the seals and building up on the block. It stumped at least 3 BRP techs, they weren't willing to tear it down to find the real source of the problem. I had enough of it and tore it apart myself. My buddy and I discovered the mag side bearing was missing about 3 balls from the cage. Not like they were ejected from a broken cage either, missing as in not a part of the assembly from day one.
Click to expand...
It is a stroker crank on its second season.. and I did have a water Ingestion issue for a bit. Motor doesn’t seem to shake any more violent than typical but very much a possibility. I am going to try to replace the coils on my total loss/then try a oem ignition.. if that doesn’t do it then it almost has to be seals. If that’s the case I’m moving to a different platform lol!
 
Jcary85

Jcary85

Site Supporter
Vendor Account
Location
Glenmoore pa
Are plugs evenly colored? Is one wet and one dry? Sounds an awful lot like it’s Running on one cylinder. Any chance the whole shot wire is grounded or something? Maybe a broken pulse line to a carb?
 
DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
Jcary85 said:
Are plugs evenly colored? Is one wet and one dry? Sounds an awful lot like it’s Running on one cylinder. Any chance the whole shot wire is grounded or something? Maybe a broken pulse line to a carb?
Click to expand...
Actually now that you reminded me, when I replaced the plugs the rear plug was light brown and the front plug still looked very clean like it was almost never firing. I did test the unit, it fires the plugs on both pickups and when cranking, but I wouldn’t rule out the possibility of a bad coil or the unit being bad and retarding my timing. The motor sounds like both are firing and both cylinders are warm but who knows. As for pulse lines I run a fuel pump to feed my full spectrums and I made sure the line wasn’t cracked or damaged. I am pretty sure I have ruled out fuel delivery but I will go through everything again.. I did find another thread from years back where a guy was having an identical issue on a TL ski and it ended up being a coil.. thank you for your advice!!!
 
Jcary85

Jcary85

Site Supporter
Vendor Account
Location
Glenmoore pa
Try swapping coils with fresh plugs. See if the plug colors follow the coils. If not, swap channels on the MSD brain and see if it follows a specific channel. If it’s a 3 channel brain and you find a bad channel you can just use the third channel in place of the bad one.

If a plug is actually white I’d suspect fueling or lack thereof causing a very lean condition.
 
DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
Jcary85 said:
Try swapping coils with fresh plugs. See if the plug colors follow the coils. If not, swap channels on the MSD brain and see if it follows a specific channel. If it’s a 3 channel brain and you find a bad channel you can just use the third channel in place of the bad one.

If a plug is actually white I’d suspect fueling or lack thereof causing a very lean condition.
Click to expand...
Really good ideas, I can’t run it under load without taking it an hour to a lake so I’m not sure if the plug read will be accurate but it should be enough to see if the cylinder is firing.
I also suspected fuel but no jets have changed, everything is clean, and I replaced almost everything on the set..
Thank you!
 
DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
Finally got to look into things a little bit
Brain light is lit when running and blinks after ign is killed
Sending out a stock ignition today to have a custom curve put in etc
Both plugs look like they are firing and the ski idles and sounds fine out of water
Would change coils and test again but I won’t have time to get to lake for the next few weeks anyways
Will update when new ignition is in to see if problem was MSD..
In the meantime I am going to post all of my several brain boxes and MSD stuff for sale
Going to leak down test and check crank seals
Thank you everyone for your help I will post resolution
 
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DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
JC-SuperJet said:
Try a New or Known Good Strong Battery. Odessey PC625 works well with the MSD Total Loss System.

Check, clean, and tighten all the MSD electrical connections. Should be done every season. Pay Special attention to the MSD Coil Grounds and the Bolts. Even the Bolts and backing Nuts must be clean of corrosion. Wire Brush comes in handy and so does Dielectric Grease.
Click to expand...
Personally my system was gone through at the start of the season and is inside of a water tight alum box.. I will verify all my connections upon removing the system for sure!
 
DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
TURBO JET said:
Stuck needle I rebuilt both carbs runs better now and I will test it this weekend
Click to expand...
Good to hear you got it
I replaced both my needle sets and seats already unfortunately
When I get the chance I’m going to throw new coils in this system and try it before the new system goes in
 
DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
Got out to the lake today on a stock ignition Slightly better but still extremely flat
Just no pull what so ever
Has to be the pump at this point
Don’t have the tools for the week to pull the prop off unfortunately
I swear there’s no cavitation but there is zero pull
Even ran it with the hood off to make sure there wasn’t some sort of smoke leak
Reeds are good
Carbs are good
Compression good
Stock ign out of ski that was just running with it in
Can’t win
 
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DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
Tuned all day
Somewhat better
If I hold it WOT the first launch is weak and if I stay WOT when it hits the water the second time it pulls like a freight train
Noticed ski is full of water this morning
Mid shaft must not be sealed to hull
Not feeling cavitation but why else would it hook up so hard only when I’m moving fast enough to force feed the scoop grate real good?
 
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DylanS

DylanS

Gorilla Smasher
Location
Lebanon Pa
Removed the outboard fuel pump and installed individual fuel pumps on my carbs today
Issue continues
Then as I’m sitting there I watch a massive air bubble come up my fuel line
Would pretty much explain why it’s running irregularly
Found the pick up line inside the tank was barely hanging on and seems as if it was pulling air directly into my lines
Going to replace and update
 
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