B-pipe cooling, routing water lines

[Freestyleriverrat]

Here is anouther hot topic for the tech section. Below is a pic of how I think I am going to route my cooling lines. In theroy don't you want the flow control valve before the bypass? The bypass lowers line pressure which you need to open the flow control valve. Let me know what you think. I also included a blank pic for you guys to sketch on to illustrate other routing options. I titled the pic below "true" dual cooling b/c both lines go into the exhaust manifold, not one to the manifold and anouther to the head pipe. Please add any coments, considerations and pics so there can be a nice well rounded thread on this issue.

**Also included is a diagram of how my pump area is set up for dual cooling.

 

[SuperJETT]

With the flow control valve before the bypass, you won't have any cooling water going through the pipe at idle other than the small amount through the injection holes. The valves are tunable so you can put it after the bypass and set it correctly.

 

[Freestyleriverrat]

Ahhh.....I see what you are saying. I guess we can title the is pic "The Right Way to Route Dual Cooling Lines w/ a Flow Control Valve". I was mainly focused on the water to the stinger. That makes sense.....so it should be along the lines of this:

 

[SuperJETT]

This would be my ideal. Even cooling to each cylinder, and the engine outlet temp is tunable without affecting the pipe temperature.

One thing I've never liked about having 2 lines going into one circuit is you can't tell if one tap on the pump is clogged or not. With individual circuits, you can tell immediately if one is clogged.

 

[Freestyleriverrat]

I was thinking that by preheating the water through the manifold and cylinders you keep the head pipe temperature warmer= increased exhaust temp = better exhaust scavenging. But since this is a water injected exhaust system I guess that is not much of a factor, and the manifold is getting the inital cold surge of water. So why split the line into two at the manifold?

I am totally making a mountain out of a mole hill on this one :thinking:

 

[Freestyleriverrat]

This would be my ideal. Even cooling to each cylinder, and the engine outlet temp is tunable without affecting the pipe temperature.

One thing I've never liked about having 2 lines going into one circuit is you can't tell if one tap on the pump is clogged or not. With individual circuits, you can tell immediately if one is clogged.

That is a good set up. My only concern is that if one line gets clogged you may not have anything supplying the cylinder. It definatly makes diagnostics easier but if a line is plugged and you are out on the water it may not get you back to shore. If you run the 2 in the manifold you double the amout of water to the cylinders, preheat it for the head pipe and could probably still easily diagnose a potential problem by running clear lines.......however seeing down to those line would be difficult.

 

[sflsurfrider]

jett, you have 1 line going in to the engine and 2 going out. even though you TEE'd before the manifold, youre still only supplying the engine with the amount of water that a single line can bring. im not sure thats such a good idea.

 

[Freestyleriverrat]

That's what I was thinking. If the water in the cylinders is under a little pressure air should be quickly forced out of the pisser and keep the waterjacket pretty well filled. This should still allow you to pin point a potential problem quickly. I now see why you spilt the line at the manifold.......this should equally cool the exhaust gas as it exists both the front and rear cylinders on the exhaust manifold. But I would just run one pisser off the cylinder if it is only being supplied by one feed line.

 

[SuperJETT]

One cooling line can handle all the cooling needed for an engine unless you're racing. In the above setup I run restrictors coming out both outlets as needed to maintain ~120F coming out of the engine. That temperature is all you should be concerned about really, as long as you have flow and it's around 120F, the engine is being cooled properly.

 

[waxhead]

i have found that one cooling line is enough
on my 7600 rpm superstock superjet runing in hot gold coast i have never had an issue
i have found over cooling can lead to seizing an engine on a long run

 

[hangtime]

I'm about to do this to my boat .How does the majority do it .:banghead:

 

[sflsurfrider]

i run 2 lines from my pump into the manifold.

one line out of the head to pisser # 1

the other line out of the head to a TEE

straight end of TEE out to pisser #2

90* end of TEE thru a jetworks flow control valve then to stinger.

 

[Freestyleriverrat]

One cooling line can handle all the cooling needed for an engine unless you're racing. In the above setup I run restrictors coming out both outlets as needed to maintain ~120F coming out of the engine.

Were do you get restrictors? I don't think I have seen those before. Are they just smaller bypass fittings? How many mm? This is a great thread that will hopefully help alot of guys out. It emphasizes not only how to route lines but the all important WHY......so guys can make educated decisions for their particular application.

 

[SuperJETT]

i run 2 lines from my pump into the manifold.

one line out of the head to pisser # 1

the other line out of the head to a TEE

straight end of TEE out to pisser #2

90* end of TEE thru a jetworks flow control valve then to stinger.

Where does the headpipe get water?

 

[SuperJETT]

Were do you get restrictors? I don't think I have seen those before. Are they just smaller bypass fittings? How many mm? This is a great thread that will hopefully help alot of guys out.

nylon bolt spacers from Home Depot. You can make your own also or use 1/4" ball valves.

 

[Freestyleriverrat]

That would be sweet to develop a small inline thermostat the size of a flow control valve to avoid both over heating and over cooling. It would aid in warm up as well and be more veristile for different water conditions. Ex.: going from one of the great lakes to the Hot Hole for FSF.

**To get everyone that may come across this thread up to speed on a flow control valve it is basically a small chamber that has a rubber ball at one end connected to a spring. Since the cooling system is fed by the pump, as rpm increases line pressure increases allowing the valve to open. This restricts water to the stinger at idle and low rpm to dry out the water box and aid in low end snap b/c the exhaust does not have to force out excess water. Simple part that works well. Washers can be added preload the spring and increses the line pressure needed to open the valve (see pic below).

 

[hangtime]

I'm gonna do mine with 2 from the pump into manifold .
# 1 from head into bottom of head pipe
out of top of head pipe to TEE
Straight part of TEE to pisser #1
90 degree part of TEE to flow control and stinger
#2 from head out of pisser #2

I hope you can picture that cause I can't :banghead:

 

[waxhead]

i just drill an old n/s for my restrictor

 

[Freestyleriverrat]

Did a little more reading on the subject from various sources. Went through installation info for the b-pipe, dual cooling install and bypass instructions from protec and this is what I think is one of the best set ups b/c (IMO):

-If a line gets clogged both the cylinders and head pipe still get water from 1 line and it should easily keep them cool enough.
-Warms the water before it hits head pipe
-Should provide nearly equal cooling of front and rear cylinder b/c flow out of both outlets on the head should be close to the same.
-still allows for fine tuning temp of cylinders w/ the use of restrictors and a full size pisser comming out of the head, or just by using a 6mm pisser.

All mentioned methods would work so I guess its just a matter of preference. I would not run the first couple diagrams that I put up though........mount flow control valve after bypass, we all agree on that one

**below are some pics of different parts like pissers, adjustable restrictors and different pisser sizes that act as restrictors. The diagrams illustrate routing the cooling lines.

 

[Frosty]

I've been running the same setup as Jett for the past 5 years with no problems at all. I prefer to have two separate circuits and by monitoring the bypasses you can tell if you have a clogging problem and pretty much where it is. The only thing i did different was the flow control valve... I just used a mikuni main jet in the stinger water line...