Super Jet HELP - stripped pole mounting bolts

[slamb33]

Guys, need help…

I was trying to remove my pole mount bracket on my RN (wdk lowered) and stripped three of the mounting bolts.

I think there was red locktite on them (did not know this, might be common to do?) as there was a silt like power on the threads of the one that came out.

So, in any event, I have three stripped bolts it a very awkward position that are very tight….
My bracket is not mounted with nuts and bolts, it is threaded, so the bolts go straight into it. It is two pieces plus brace on the inside of the hull. The top piece where the pole pin goes is what is threaded (triangle shape). There is a base piece that is not threaded that is just sandwiched between the top piece and hull.

Any suggestions? I am planning to cut the heads off so I can get the bracket off the boat and then either drill out the stubs or use an extractor set, or hit it with a torch, but this does not seem fun. Would appreciate any ideas or tips…

Also, the bolts seemed to be stainless, going into aluminum? Does that seem right?

what should I put on the bolts next time, anti size? what kind of torque should I apply assuming it is ss going into aluminum?

Thanks in advance.

 

[oxnard111]

I had the exact same thing happen on my WDK bracket. It was that aluminum plate on the inside that caused so much of the corrosion.

Yes it is normal to have stainless bolts going into aluminum.

You should have used anti-seize rather than red loctite.

Cut heads of the bolts off from the inside if possible. You need to leave some material that you can grab with a pair of vice grips. Then torch it and try to remove the rest of the bolts with vice grips. Don't use extractors, you'll just break the those off also.

Sorry to say, but that bracket may be a lost cause if you can cut off the heads from the inside.

There are very few bolts on a jetski that need red loctite.

 

[slamb33]

Thanks for the great info. I think I can cut the heads off with a dremel and it is looking like that is my only option...

I didn't put red loctite on it (I've never had the bracket off myself before), I was just speculating that it might be that, since the bolts were so tight and there was this silt like substance on the threads of the one bolt that came out.

How much torque can I apply on re-installation (assuming I get it off) using the ss bolts?

 

[feartheride]

You say stripped bolts and ur talking about cutting them off are they stuck in and just spinning..
loctite acts as an antisieze, I would just use a removable loctite to reassemble, antisieze makes a mess,
silt like power on the threads sounds more like corrosion, stainless bolts in aluminum is ok
So if you end up with broken pieces in the holes that are siezed in there, you wont be able to use a screw extractor alone, you will need heat because if the extractor breaks ur job just got a lot harder unless u have an edm machine to burn it out..

The best thin is to grind the broken bolt so it is flat ,center punch the center ( very important to get in the center in case u end up having to drill bolt out completely)
then use a center drill then start with a smaller drill (not to small that it will break) just will be easier to stay on center and will drill easier then step up to the size u need for the easy out.
Install easy out and add heat. you need to get heat in fast so aluminum heats up and stainless bolt wont, and will have to cool part between bolts..
If that doesn't work continue to step up drill sizes untill you get to the tap drill size for that bolt ( so if it's an 8x 1.25 thread tap drill will be 8mm -1.25 mm = 6.75 mm ect.)
You can then usually pick at the pieces of thread left in the threads with a sharp pointed all or stong dental pick..
If all that fails u will need to use a time sert or heli coil
Have fun !!

 

[slamb33]

Oh man, sounds the opposite of fun...

The bolts are not spinning, the allen heads are stripped. So I assume the threads inside the mount are still good.

will a heat gun be good enough, or should I use a torch?

 

[kraqus]

I have the same mounting plate but I replaced the Allen screws with regular SS hex screws.
When I put the new screws in I used plenty of Marine grease. I use it all the time on any screws on my Boat.

I went to remove the plate once afterward and the bolts were tight....and I mean tight.
I heated up the Bolts with a torch then squirted WD40 on it.....the bolts sucked it all in!
I repeated the step a couple of times and I was finally able to move the bolts.

From now on whenever I have to remove any bolt on my boat, I get a feel for it.
If the bolt is not moving with some reasonable pressure, Heat and WD40 it is.
It has always worked for me.





Benny

 

[slamb33]

thanks Benny. did you heat the bolts from inside the hull, or the mounting plate from the outside?

 

[kraqus]

From the inside.
I know is an awkward position but it is the only way.
Hit the head of the screw with the flame, make sure is HOT, then spray WD40.
It will get smokey.....make sure you do it in a ventilated area.
ALWAYS WEAR EYE PROTECTION.




Benny

 

[slamb33]

I follow... problem is, my allen head bolts are stripped, so no matter what, I'm not really going to be able to remove them.

I think I will have to cut the heads off then try the heat/wd40 on the bench for the studs with vice grips or whatever...

 

[kraqus]

I would still give it a shot as is.
Vice grips are able to hold firm on a lot of shapes including round Allen heads.
Heat up that sucker a couple of times, spray WD40 and use the biggest Vice grip you have.
I think it will give in eventually.






Benny

 

[McDog]

What he said^^^^^^^^

 

[slamb33]

okay thanks guys I will give this a try.

 

[shaunsteezy]

this works better then wd-40...

get it fixed before pismo!!

 

[kraqus]

Yes....by all means use that too.
I just used WD40 cause it was all I had then and it worked.





Benny

 

[feartheride]

worth even buying new vice grips that have good teeth on them as opposed to old worn out ones or very small pipe wrench, I have ones that are only 8" long..

If u are heating bolt to suck in wd ,dont try to remove till they cool , if bolt expands faster then aluminum it won't come out easily.. That's why it is best to try to expand aluminum and try to remove bolt before bolt heats up to much and expands..and no heat gun won't cut it, but remember to much heat with a torch and aluminum will melt

 

[swapmeet]

You say stripped bolts and ur talking about cutting them off are they stuck in and just spinning..
loctite acts as an antisieze, I would just use a removable loctite to reassemble, antisieze makes a mess,
silt like power on the threads sounds more like corrosion, stainless bolts in aluminum is ok
So if you end up with broken pieces in the holes that are siezed in there, you wont be able to use a screw extractor alone, you will need heat because if the extractor breaks ur job just got a lot harder unless u have an edm machine to burn it out..

The best thin is to grind the broken bolt so it is flat ,center punch the center ( very important to get in the center in case u end up having to drill bolt out completely)
then use a center drill then start with a smaller drill (not to small that it will break) just will be easier to stay on center and will drill easier then step up to the size u need for the easy out.
Install easy out and add heat. you need to get heat in fast so aluminum heats up and stainless bolt wont, and will have to cool part between bolts..
If that doesn't work continue to step up drill sizes untill you get to the tap drill size for that bolt ( so if it's an 8x 1.25 thread tap drill will be 8mm -1.25 mm = 6.75 mm ect.)
You can then usually pick at the pieces of thread left in the threads with a sharp pointed all or stong dental pick..
If all that fails u will need to use a time sert or heli coil
Have fun !!

This is everything I was thinking.

As far as cutting the heads off, if you don't have a big compressor and air tools, there are electric grinders and thin blades that will work a lot better at cutting the heads off than a damn dremel.

I like the idea of buying a new vice grip for the sharpest teeth. Good stuff... .

 

[slamb33]

guys, thanks for all the input.

I just made a Lowes run for all kinds of stuff (two sizes of blow torches, two sizes of vice grips, penetrating oil, etc)

I'm not super experienced with this kind of stuff but I am determined to get these out / resolve this myself.

I got a standard type blow torch (14oz blue canister) and also a little hand held pistol grip butane one. I am thinking this small one might make too much heat if I am focusing it on the bolt head inside the hull? It claims to be 2500 degrees or something like that...

Also, in terms of trying to suck in wd40 or penetrating oil, will this work if the bolts are still 100% tight? Also, what is the risk of fire/explosion if I spray on a very hot bolt?

thanks again

 

[kraqus]

Also, in terms of trying to suck in wd40 or penetrating oil, will this work if the bolts are still 100% tight? Also, what is the risk of fire/explosion if I spray on a very hot bolt?

thanks again

I don't know about other spray lubricants.
I know WD40 will not ignite if Sprayed on a HOT surface.
You will hear a lot of hissing and smoke will rise.....lots of it!

I hope this Video clears up your doubts:

I think what you see catching fire in the video is the Gas....NOT the lubricant.
You can see how after being sprayed it will not ignite even with a flame over it.
You always want to wear EYE PROTECTION.






Benny

 

[slamb33]

UPDATE:

after many attempts with vice grips, etc, we ended up cutting off the bolts with a dremel

we expected that the triangle parts at the top would come free of the base that appeared to be sandwiched between the hull and triangles.

to our surprise, there are two bolts (again, allen head) holding the base to the triangles.

these are also totally frozen

we were initially trying to avoid taking the pole fully off (the cables and everything are still running through it)

we are soaking it in penetrating oil over night and we are going to try an hit it with the torch tomorrow with a long ratchet with allen head socket and hope we can get the triangles released from the base.

failing that, can anyone tell me the best way to get the cables and wires out of the pole? which do I disconnect in the hull and feed through, which do I disconnect from the handle bars?

on the bright side, before getting involved in the pole mount disaster tonight, we changed out the motor mounts for cold fusion mounts and shimmed the engine up perfect. so at least that's a small win....

 

[Profound-Dynamics]

On the bright side to take off the pole and the cables is pretty easy.

- Remove the start/stop ( 2 sets of connectors you need to disconnect.)
- Remove throttle cable
- Remove steering cable
- Remove Ride Plate
- Remove cable from nozzle
- Loosen steering cable trough hull fitting