Krashindustries.com is selling 997cc RTR Skis for $12,000.00

[cookn]

this is heading off the rails again with the boat wakes but it really is too bad. I see this as the end of krash, but I always knew they wouldnt be able to match the quality of oem yamaha and what the aftermarket is already doing

 

[Parsonsjb88]

Okay I just have to say, it's way too easy for people to bash a company when the only stake that have in the company is a $500 refundable deposit and for many people, nothing.

In Krash's defense... They are a brand new company. Every new company, even Yamaha when they started went through their fair share of issues that reached the customer. Quality and durability come with time. If anyone expected them to release a flawless Yamaha quality/reliable ski on their first release clearly doesn't understand product design and manufacturing. Not only does it take failures to learn about weaknesses in your designs, but it takes years to develop strong working relationships with suppliers to ensure they are following the agreed processes and matching your expectations for quality control.

Look at all the issues that even the automotive OEM's have every year that reach the customer. How many recalls have happened and buybacks from some of the biggest names in the industry? Product development and release is not some simple task that goes exactly as planned. I think people need to take a deep breath and realize how much they've accomplished rather than focusing all their energy on a half a dozen issues.

I'm not saying don't share your issues and concerns; it just feels like this thread has turned from a product support/FAQ page into a witch-hunt. Personally, as long as they keep honoring their warranty, learning from their mistakes, and improving their product I think they will do just fine but there will inevitably be headaches to the early adopters.

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[H22bomb]

Well said, let’s support new development and innovation to help grow our sport. I personally have a Reaper on order, I do expect growing pains, however I also believe that the effort will be worth the result

 

[Big Kahuna]

Okay I just have to say, it's way too easy for people to bash a company when the only stake that have in the company is a $500 refundable deposit and for many people, nothing.

In Krash's defense... They are a brand new company. Every new company, even Yamaha when they started went through their fair share of issues that reached the customer. Quality and durability come with time. If anyone expected them to release a flawless Yamaha quality/reliable ski on their first release clearly doesn't understand product design and manufacturing. Not only does it take failures to learn about weaknesses in your designs, but it takes years to develop strong working relationships with suppliers to ensure they are following the agreed processes and matching your expectations for quality control.

Look at all the issues that even the automotive OEM's have every year that reach the customer. How many recalls have happened and buybacks from some of the biggest names in the industry? Product development and release is not some simple task that goes exactly as planned. I think people need to take a deep breath and realize how much they've accomplished rather than focusing all their energy on a half a dozen issues.

I'm not saying don't share your issues and concerns; it just feels like this thread has turned from a product support/FAQ page into a witch-hunt. Personally, as long as they keep honoring their warranty, learning from their mistakes, and improving their product I think they will do just fine but there will inevitably be headaches to the early adopters.

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Actually, Yamaha spent a fair amount of time doing R&D on the first waverunners. About 3 years worth before the 86 Waverunner 500 came out. They did not design it and put it out for sale to the open market before it was a proven concept. https://global.yamaha-motor.com/business/waverunner/30th/story/ Great Article to read about the History of the Waverunner and Yamaha Watercraft Division.


Personally, I think Krash should have done what Wetjet did. They contracted with Yamaha to supply Yamaha Based engines built to their spec's. (The 61X Wetjet Motor). Build their Hulls and components and install the Yamaha Supplied Drivelines. Heck, they could have been based off the GP800 style motors and had close to 900 cc's.

 

[Parsonsjb88]

Actually, Yamaha spent a fair amount of time doing R&D on the first waverunners. About 3 years worth before the 86 Waverunner 500 came out. They did not design it and put it out for sale to the open market before it was a proven concept. https://global.yamaha-motor.com/business/waverunner/30th/story/ Great Article to read about the History of the Waverunner and Yamaha Watercraft Division.


Personally, I think Krash should have done what Wetjet did. They contracted with Yamaha to supply Yamaha Based engines built to their spec's. (The 61X Wetjet Motor). Build their Hulls and components and install the Yamaha Supplied Drivelines. Heck, they could have been based off the GP800 style motors and had close to 900 cc's.

I see what you're saying, however you're talking about a company that was already producing products for 31 years before they released the Waverunner. You're comparing apples to oranges. Krash is entirely new with much less backing. Unfortunately that means relying on early adopters to fund R&D.

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[Big Kahuna]

I see what you're saying, however you're talking about a company that was already producing products for 31 years before they released the Waverunner. You're comparing apples to oranges. Krash is entirely new with much less backing. Unfortunately that means relying on early adopters to fund R&D.

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Quality Control is still Quality Control. Does not mater the size of your company...... Not going to do much good when you run off current and future customers. I know they are small. Hope they can get this ball rolling.

 

[cookn]

I work in the manufacturing industry and understand what it takes to do exactly what they are doing and why I always said I will be surprised if it works. I'm not hating just to hate, I just knew they were having problems with their hulls and components long before people were talking about the rtr's so adding their own complete engine design to the mix made no sense. I'm just talking out loud and would like to see the sport progress but this is not the answer. I still have hope as people figure them out and find the flaws but its still the fact you won't go down to your local yamaha dealer and order gaskets and be on the water faster

 

[GabeH]

I see what you're saying, however you're talking about a company that was already producing products for 31 years before they released the Waverunner. You're comparing apples to oranges. Krash is entirely new with much less backing. Unfortunately that means relying on early adopters to fund R&D.

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True, however Krash also has the benefit of over four decades of pwc 2-stroke manufacturing best practices from Kawasaki, Yamaha, and others to draw from (at least from an outside perspective). As BK said, QC is QC. Now having said all that, I applaud their boldness but their product rollout may have been too aggressive. Time will tell. I like my Predator hull. Krash makes excellent surf hulls so there’s that.


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[Chadvski]

Hard to believe isn't it. I don't really want to put anymore out there as things may end up in a legal battle. I have more horror stories, dont be afraid to bail and let them them figure things out for a year. Sorry for Krash because they are nice guys. Really sorry for myself two skis I can't ride. I want them to succeed for the sake of the sport!

 

[Lumberjack]

Wait what... you can't leave us hanging
People need to know the truth before they waste their hard earned money.

 

[Chadvski]

Okay I just have to say, it's way too easy for people to bash a company when the only stake that have in the company is a $500 refundable deposit and for many people, nothing.

In Krash's defense... They are a brand new company. Every new company, even Yamaha when they started went through their fair share of issues that reached the customer. Quality and durability come with time. If anyone expected them to release a flawless Yamaha quality/reliable ski on their first release clearly doesn't understand product design and manufacturing. Not only does it take failures to learn about weaknesses in your designs, but it takes years to develop strong working relationships with suppliers to ensure they are following the agreed processes and matching your expectations for quality control.

Look at all the issues that even the automotive OEM's have every year that reach the customer. How many recalls have happened and buybacks from some of the biggest names in the industry? Product development and release is not some simple task that goes exactly as planned. I think people need to take a deep breath and realize how much they've accomplished rather than focusing all their energy on a half a dozen issues.

I'm not saying don't share your issues and concerns; it just feels like this thread has turned from a product support/FAQ page into a witch-hunt. Personally, as long as they keep honoring their warranty, learning from their mistakes, and improving their product I think they will do just fine but there will inevitably be headaches to the early adopters.

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Put your 25000 dollars towards two useless skis and see how you feel then!

 

[Harbor]

Put your 25000 dollars towards two useless skis and see how you feel then![/QUOTE



We might've had no idea If it weren't for you and the others in this thread posting the issues they are having, thank you to all of you!

 

[mrjdm]

I'm not saying don't share your issues and concerns; it just feels like this thread has turned from a product support/FAQ page into a witch-hunt. Personally, as long as they keep honoring their warranty, learning from their mistakes, and improving their product I think they will do just fine but there will inevitably be headaches to the early adopters.

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What good is the warranty if you have to ship your ski back to australia and be without it for 4 months? Or play backyard mechanic with somebody on the phone with you?

I had a deposit on a RTR reaper, I pulled it after the wait being too long and hearing some issues customers had. I would still buy a RTR from them but probably will give it 2-4 years for them to get it together.

 

[Parsonsjb88]

I wasn't trying to dismiss anyone's frustrations with Krash or fears. Chad and any other person whom has had issues has every right to be pissed and so would I. Hard not to be when it's eating into your summer. The problem is, instead of talking about the issues and working with Krash to resolve them, all we are doing is bashing Krash and their name and convincing people to not buy and/or pull out their deposits. If that keeps up, it won't be too long before we burn their reputation and they pull out, which effectively means the 60+ skis that are out there become actually useless to the people that already purchased. If we actually want to the sport to change, we have to be willing to work with Krash and give them a chance. Yes they overpromised delivery dates and delayed orders and yes they are having a few issues durability wise with few components. However, from the conversations I've had with Krash it seems like they are working a quickly as possible to get the issues resolved and people back on the water. I would be much more concerned if they were doing nothing, that's clearly not the case since Nick and another Tech are coming to North America to personally check out these issues and work with the customers to change out parts.



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[Parsonsjb88]

What good is the warranty if you have to ship your ski back to australia and be without it for 4 months? Or play backyard mechanic with somebody on the phone with you?

I had a deposit on a RTR reaper, I pulled it after the wait being too long and hearing some issues customers had. I would still buy a RTR from them but probably will give it 2-4 years for them to get it together.

That person decided to ship it back, their perogitive. And that's literally the definition of a parts only warranty. I thought that was very clear from the beginning but maybe I just understood it differently. From day one I fully expected to have to wrench anytime there was an issue and Krash would just send me the parts.

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[Big Kahuna]

I thought at best, send it to Chris Grace on the East Coast for Warranty repair.

As far as your comment about people bashing. Not really that. It is just people discussing. the same as you and I would do on the phone or in person. It is just people talking about it....... Yeah, it sucks for those involved. It sucks for Krash....... But the measure of a company is not always about how well they do something. It is about how well they deal with customers when there is a problem. poop happens sometimes. but what was done to make the smell go away.......

 

[Quinc]

What is the saying; cheap, reliable, fast, you can only pick two? Krash is selling a 25k ski for 12k.

Even with the issue's coming out I would still buy one(if I wasn't paying 20k a year on daycare..) . Just too bad they didn't have the engine parts copied from a known snowmobile platform so parts would be easier to get.

 

[Lumberjack]

Was really hoping they would of used an existing drivetrain that was proven. This would of eliminated all of these issues. Most of these motors only have minimal hours too, time will tell. I'm still very happy i purchased a 701 based FS2 evo
for less than these. You could even buy a really nice used edge with a little less power for the same price point. Going on 2 seasons just fuel and oil and i couldnt be happier.

 

[Chadvski]

I wasn't trying to dismiss anyone's frustrations with Krash or fears. Chad and any other person whom has had issues has every right to be pissed and so would I. Hard not to be when it's eating into your summer. The problem is, instead of talking about the issues and working with Krash to resolve them, all we are doing is bashing Krash and their name and convincing people to not buy and/or pull out their deposits. If that keeps up, it won't be too long before we burn their reputation and they pull out, which effectively means the 60+ skis that are out there become actually useless to the people that already purchased. If we actually want to the sport to change, we have to be willing to work with Krash and give them a chance. Yes they overpromised delivery dates and delayed orders and yes they are having a few issues durability wise with few components. However, from the conversations I've had with Krash it seems like they are working a quickly as possible to get the issues resolved and people back on the water. I would be much more concerned if they were doing nothing, that's clearly not the case since Nick and another Tech are coming to North America to personally check out these issues and work with the customers to change out parts.



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Just so you understand I have been talking with krash and working with them. They are a first class group of guys! I dont believe I e bashed them. Only presented the reality of what is going on. I can't wait for nick to get here and meet him he has very kind on the phone. I've treated them with the same respect as well. Ultimately you have to realize that 4 attempts to ride these skis have resulted in complete failures. The quality and problems I had before even started them told me I was off to a bad start. If I didnt believe in what they were trying to do I wouldn't have two of these. I dont believe the product I have will last or continue to perform reliably. I worry about being stranded in wavy conditions like happened to me this weekend on lake michigan. Fortunately I was staying close to shore. Easy to be a fan when you're not the one who has a lot of money invested in machines that dont run. No anger or hate just great disappointment and If my friend asked my advice I would share it because 12000 is still a lot of money.

 

[SuperHumanJetski]

Was really hoping they would of used an existing drivetrain that was proven. This would of eliminated all of these issues.

I agree. I met Nick and Chris last year when they visited Michigan promoting their skis and when I asked them which parts they make in house they said all of them. This is what turned me off from ever considering one of their skis and it's a common downfall for a lot of companies (e.g. LEGO in the early 2000s tried to sell their kits with 600+ different pieces and if they had issues with 1/600 pieces they couldn't ship anything out; Tesla is also having similar problems).

If I were in their shoes I would be much more inclined to start off making a few things in house and sourcing the other parts, even if the price point was higher. Over time is when you slowly start vertically integrating and bringing the production of outsourced parts back in house. It's simple business.

Most large companies that you find that are making near 100% of their products in house did not start at that point.