Porting engine cases

This is the second motor I’ve ported and looking for opinions.
I will be creating an epoxy slope on the bottom of the intake openings in the case to reduce volume. Cylinder is ported.
Motor will be a 772. Bpipe, intake, and 46mm carbs in a superjet. I’m shooting for 200psi and running AVgas.

I’m not finished with the porting and have to clean it up a bit but wanted to see if you guys would suggest I open it up anymore
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Not completely finished but you get the idea
 

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The middle beefy area that is restrictive needs to be opened up for more volume. im talking down below kinda where the oil galleys are. Then youll want to match the transfer port on the case to the transfer port on the jug to get that sucker to flow!
 

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This is the second motor I’ve ported and looking for opinions.
I will be creating an epoxy slope on the bottom of the intake openings in the case to reduce volume. Cylinder is ported.
Motor will be a 772. Bpipe, intake, and 46mm carbs in a superjet. I’m shooting for 200psi and running AVgas.

I’m not finished with the porting and have to clean it up a bit but wanted to see if you guys would suggest I open it up anymore
2fd282c385ac2397e486fea9895bf5f7.jpg

faa297392a45cc7618da93f3784e7dae.jpg

ecd11a3562f23b71876acae5eabd7a69.jpg
Good job. Still got a ways to go
 

Jr.

Standing Tall
Staff member
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Location
Hot-Lanta
Fyi, Just because something is posted on youtube, does not carry validly. you still need to do your homework on what actually yields positive gains. Losses come just as easily as gains. Be very carful what source you choose as your performance inspiration. Both good and bad information abound on the net.
 

Jcary85

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Glenmoore pa
Fyi, Just because something is posted on youtube, does not carry validly. you still need to do your homework on what actually yields positive gains. Losses come just as easily as gains. Be very carful what source you choose as your performance inspiration. Both good and bad information abound on the net.
Jr, is there bad info in that specific video? He seems to know what he’s doing but I certainly don’t have enough experience to say he’s doing something wrong. Obviously you do :)
 

clouse22

BDB Kustomz
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Location
Lake Orion, MI
Fyi, Just because something is posted on youtube, does not carry validly. you still need to do your homework on what actually yields positive gains. Losses come just as easily as gains. Be very carful what source you choose as your performance inspiration. Both good and bad information abound on the net.

What do you mean?? I cant just take my dremel in my shop and start hacking?? jkjkj :p

I just enjoy learning about the process what goes in. Really makes you appreciate what engine builders do to make a rippin setup and why the cost of a performance motor is where its at. I have great respect for the people that do it, truly an art form.
 
What do you mean?? I cant just take my dremel in my shop and start hacking?? jkjkj :p

I just enjoy learning about the process what goes in. Really makes you appreciate what engine builders do to make a rippin setup and why the cost of a performance motor is where its at. I have great respect for the people that do it, truly an art form.
Sure you can. Hack away. On about your 20th set of cases you will probably start learning what you are doing :)
 
Fyi, Just because something is posted on youtube, does not carry validly. you still need to do your homework on what actually yields positive gains. Losses come just as easily as gains. Be very carful what source you choose as your performance inspiration. Both good and bad information abound on the net.
++1

A good example is after reading 2 stroke tuners handbook, some of his porting
advice can get you in trouble.

I am not much of a Yamaha guy, but it looks like you filled the casting voids
completely with JB weld, why?

I know why you fill them with JB weld, but why did you fill it to the top?

Why 200 psi? and how do you know your estimate will be close?


Bill M.

Seems like there is a possibility that you have done a lot of mods at one time.
Hopefully there are no big changes in the cylinder. It can be easy to plan big,
and in turn cause yourself problems with tuning your set-up.

After making your modifications, what approximate rpm is the engine going to
make peak HP, and what have you done to prevent a wide open throttle seizure?
 
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I am not much of a Yamaha guy, but it looks like you filled the casting voids
completely with JB weld, why?

I know why you fill them with JB weld, but why did you fill it to the top?
he filled both voids to the top for max strength. the yamaha cases are somewhat thin so in order to port the cases, the voids must be filled. he is also running bigger sleeves than the factory with the big bore, so the cases have to be clearanced on both sides of the sleeve area. you can see how thin it gets in the second and third pics on the exhaust side of the cases where the epoxy touches it.
 
Location
dfw
Fyi, Just because something is posted on youtube, does not carry validly. you still need to do your homework on what actually yields positive gains. Losses come just as easily as gains. Be very carful what source you choose as your performance inspiration. Both good and bad information abound on the net.
Opening the window may be beneficial all else equal. Power is mostly in the cylinder and pipe. A programable ignition can improve response and use cheaper gas.. Theres a lot more thrust gain in a "mag" pump and bored nozzle than ANY case/carb mod.
 
@Jr. I totally understand not wanting to share hard earned information, but I am wondering have you done some sort of testing that revealed a situation where case porting was WORSE than stock? Like can it be done so wrong that it is a detriment? (hopefully that can be answered without giving up too much of the secret sauce)

Or @MTRHEAD

I could see maybe due to an increase in case volume, but that change in case volume seems like it would be pretty similar for "good" case porting and "shoddy" case porting, and the reputable builders seem to universally do some sort of porting in the cases to open them up.

I'm guessing a whole lot of people (myself included) have grabbed the die grinder and hogged'er out completely based on looking at what other people are doing and very few people have done any kind of actual testing. Lots of people repeating what they saw on the internet but not actually knowing anything other than that's what everybody says on the internet.

It's really hard for me to imagine that this is a thing where subtle differences can make big change in performance, especially after giving Kawasaki cases a good look (they are way more restricted from reeds to crankcase, or at least that's how they look to me). I question if the case porting even makes a difference on a stockish Yamaha, but I ported my cases so I'm another one blindly following the crowd.
 

Jr.

Standing Tall
Staff member
Site Supporter
Location
Hot-Lanta
@Jr. I totally understand not wanting to share hard earned information, but I am wondering have you done some sort of testing that revealed a situation where case porting was WORSE than stock? Like can it be done so wrong that it is a detriment? (hopefully that can be answered without giving up too much of the secret sauce)

Or @MTRHEAD

I could see maybe due to an increase in case volume, but that change in case volume seems like it would be pretty similar for "good" case porting and "shoddy" case porting, and the reputable builders seem to universally do some sort of porting in the cases to open them up.

I'm guessing a whole lot of people (myself included) have grabbed the die grinder and hogged'er out completely based on looking at what other people are doing and very few people have done any kind of actual testing. Lots of people repeating what they saw on the internet but not actually knowing anything other than that's what everybody says on the internet.

It's really hard for me to imagine that this is a thing where subtle differences can make big change in performance, especially after giving Kawasaki cases a good look (they are way more restricted from reeds to crankcase, or at least that's how they look to me). I question if the case porting even makes a difference on a stockish Yamaha, but I ported my cases so I'm another one blindly following the crowd.


Ok, Ill bite, but understand, Im going to give you food for thought, without my technical data. As I would use to design a clients project.

First off, from the very beginning of my pwc career, I was not only a mechanic / tuner, but a rider in my own right.
I continue to ride currently, and use my personal equipment as a test bed. I believe im one of very few tuners that also ride. So having first hand knowledge of what happens every time I make changes is key. There are a lot of elements at play.

For basics, an engine is an air pump. You need to understand “flow” What goes in, must go out. How the internal pressures ( positive and negative) “flow” thur the motor all plays a part. Yes, you can go too far, and I have sent many motors to the scrap heap because I have gone too far. The learning curve can be steep and costly. While its very true, two stroke principal applies to all mods. PWC powerplants are uniquely different. They need to perform in a vacuum type motor bay, which can be very hot and humid. They must operate from just off idle, to full rpm load, so they need to have a broad spectrum powerband. , All this said, we now go back to “Flow”. Flow Characteristics change according to displacement, desired powerband, peak rpm, required load. ( plus numerous other factors) so your flowrates and volumes thru the motor need to be altered. Here is something to give you the idea.
Case porting a 760 BB motor that is intended to run duel 38’s. Do you grind Big transfer tunnels or small?
If you start with smaller to match cfm of the 38 carb, incoming charge will stay at a higher pressure, due to matched volume. Say you grind out large tunnels? What happens to your pressure? See where this is going? Its easy to go too far. This applies to big stroker motors as well, just at a different level.

Thank you for respecting my knowledge and background, and not asking me to exploit it here. Im on my 37th year building performance watercraft motors. I have certainly learned a thing or two along the way. Most all credible builders keep their secrets closely guarded. Those secrets have come from many long days and countless failures.
The very best advise I could give anyone of you looking learn what makes these motor tick, buy a bunch of used parts and experiment. Expect to see more failures than success. You will learn far better than watching a youtube video, of some guy selling something for nothing?

Ski ya, Paul
 
Location
dfw
Everything has to be correct to get the absolute most out of whatever "it" is that you desire. Most poor performing skis are just miss loaded or piped. For an experiment in case porting, throw your favorite top end on a 650 case. It probably wont be as bad as you would expect.
 
++1

A good example is after reading 2 stroke tuners handbook, some of his porting
advice can get you in trouble.

I am not much of a Yamaha guy, but it looks like you filled the casting voids
completely with JB weld, why?

I know why you fill them with JB weld, but why did you fill it to the top?

Why 200 psi? and how do you know your estimate will be close?


Bill M.

Seems like there is a possibility that you have done a lot of mods at one time.
Hopefully there are no big changes in the cylinder. It can be easy to plan big,
and in turn cause yourself problems with tuning your set-up.

After making your modifications, what approximate rpm is the engine going to
make peak HP, and what have you done to prevent a wide open throttle seizure?

Yeah I filled them all because I may decide to do an aftermarket cylinder in the future on those cases and would have to be bored bigger for the sleeve of the cylinder to bE inserted. The JB weld will become part of the gasket sealing surface. They will milled to be even with the surface.
I’ve asked around and it seems like 36cc or 37 domes will give about 200psi with my setup I’m going to build it with 36s and see if that gives 200psi. If I have to get different domes then that’s ok.

And about a run away lean throttle condition. Honestly I’m not sure. I’ve thought about it and that was my next thing to research. Start with what I think is too rich and be ready to plug up the top of carbs?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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