The electric Jet ski!!

[Maxumflux]

you would need temparature sensors and water control solenoids controlling the flow based on feedback from the cooling sensors. that would work for the batteries, but the motor still needs to breathe or it will toast. you can't just wrap a copper cooling coil around a brushless motor and not give it any air.

you could blow air in with an r/c duct fan then when the tether is pulled a servo closes the flap letting air in.... just an idea

 

[227]

I am beyond stoke! I remember last year there was a tread about Electric Jet skis and most just laughed about it. I am really happy to see that there is actually people working on it....and a few peeps interested on what is going to come out of it.





Yes they are. The main reason why 2 stroke are outlawed is because they contaminate. This is based on the EnviroNAZIS so called "research". I am also aware of the 200 yards zone in the surf, however I am not going to ride next to people, I will look for the most desolated beach to launch and do my thing. Rangers don't care so much in desolated areas and my main concern is to be stop based on the "polution" crap. As a matter of fact I would not be surprised if those same rangers will be glad to see a "Green" Jet ski.....


Moving? HELL YEAH!

Trust me I am looking for work in the SLO area.....I already convinced my GF so I am half way there....LOL!



Benny

I just checked Californias Boating website and apparently the laws do differ according to your location. However statewide I could find NO RESTRICTIONS for salt water (or river) operation specifcally banning 2 stroke powered watercraft. ANY restrictions which exist are due to the nature of the manuverability of PWC and hazzards they pose when operated in close vicinity to other types of boats. PWC USE IS RESTRICTED IN MANY LAKES. I also called the local Harbor Police who confirmed all “MOTORIZED” vessels either 2 stroke, 4 stroke, ELECTRIC, coal, nuclear, etc, etc are restricted from use with 200 yrds of the shore line. The ban has nothing to do with the type of power of the vessel, only that it is “MOTORIZED”, in other words if you can’t ride a two stroke then you can’t ride an electric powered ski either. Don’t get me wrong I’m not bashing the electric Jetski idea, IF they can make one that would be great, however they will mainly benefit guys who want to ride on Lake Tahoe as there use will fall under the same restrictions/bans that 2 strokes do concerning there operation in the surf.


This was taken Directly from the Californa Department of Boating and Waterways Website


http://www.dbw.ca.gov/Environmental/TwoStroke/

Facts About Two-Stroke Vessel Engines
• Two-stroke engines are not "banned" for use on all waterways in California, nor is there any plan to do so.
• There are no salt-water or river restrictions in California on high-emission two-stroke engines, excluding personal watercraft (vessels such as Jet Skis) bans in some areas. For example, San Francisco has prohibited personal watercraft within 1200 feet of its shoreline. See "Local Restrictions" on our Web page for a list of lakes.

 

[kraqus]

The information out there is so messed up and confusing that the authorities don't even know what is going on....Seriously!
So.... I guess as long as I am not seen near swimmers then I am good to go.....Actually I don't even want to be seen at all.

I think the time has come for me to start looking around Highway 1 for a "Super" secluded cove and get my weekly fix. I have seen a few of them.....

Thanks for the info 227....



Benny

 

[Motorheads5]

agreed. kinda like that water thing we invented that I drew up...lol

haha Yeah are we rich yet :thinking:

 

[djkorn1]

Well, we're not quite at 80hp... But DJKorn's ski should still be pretty cool. And it should be a little lighter than when DJ rode it.

The good motor controllers don't have too much of a heat issue, and the batteries have been pretty well behaved as far as heat goes.

Heat is an issue for IC engines because they're so inefficient (2/3 of the energy goes to heating up the water...); the electric setup is between 80%-95% efficient, depending on load. At this point, only very minor provisions have had to be made for cooling...

Alan Kroeper
Revolt Hydrosport

I stoked that my old ski is being put to good use! I still owe you a front bumper for it. (never found it, but I'll order you a new one). Can't wait until January to see pics! :fing02:

 

[the WaTeRhAwK]

you could blow air in with an r/c duct fan then when the tether is pulled a servo closes the flap letting air in.... just an idea

good idea, but how are you going to keep water from getting into the duct fan motor, it needs to breathe too. not to mention the fact that even with it set up that way, you would still be getting small amount of water into the main motor = bad idea.


the only way you would successfully pull this off with as much water that gets into the hulls of a freestyle machine, is a closed compressed air-fed circuit, with a one-way pressure relief valve.

so, a copper coil water cooled battery case, with temperature sensors regulating water flow via solenoids, for nominal battery operating temps, and a closed compressed air circuit with a one-way pressure relief valve so the motor can breathe. and a sealed compartment.

 

[Maxumflux]

good idea, but how are you going to keep water from getting into the duct fan motor, it needs to breathe too. not to mention the fact that even with it set up that way, you would still be getting small amount of water into the main motor = bad idea.


the only way you would successfully pull this off with as much water that gets into the hulls of a freestyle machine, is a closed compressed air-fed circuit, with a one-way pressure relief valve.

so, a copper coil water cooled battery case, with temperature sensors regulating water flow via solenoids, for nominal battery operating temps, and a closed compressed air circuit with a one-way pressure relief valve so the motor can breathe. and a sealed compartment.

or pressurize the cabin with co2 and accellerate the cooling lines with it...

but then you have to worry about ice..

 

[the WaTeRhAwK]

haha Yeah are we rich yet :thinking:

give it some time bro, I still have to mock up a plastic one and test it before it goes to billet/

 

[kraqus]

Who is this guy that "holds" the patent for the electric Jet ski? Is this your friend?

Check this out.
http://www.quantyausa.com/about-press-20081009.php


WHAT MOTOR IS THIS BIKE RUNNING?!
1 hour running time? You can fit 2 of those batteries in a Superjet...

This is QUANTYA's Youtube Channel. Lot more videos in there:

http://www.youtube.com/user/quantya?blend=1&ob=4


They are based out of NY.

Quantya USA/Swiss Electric Movement
6800 Jericho Turnpike
Suite 120W
Syosset, NY 11791

• Telephone: (516) 393-5844
• Telephone: (866) QUANTYA
• Fax: (516) 393-5819
• Email: info@quantya.us

http://myspace.com/Quantyaus
http://twitter.com/QuantyaUSA






Benny

 

[old-man-on-couch]

(If you were asking me...)

I don't know who this guy is, actually.

He had the insight to patent an electric jet ski 10 years after hobbyists started making them themselves; next he's going to patent a paperweight made of something heavier than air...

anyway-

That's a pretty cool bike. One of the problems for us is that it takes A LOT more power to get on plane than to accelerate a wheeled vehicle.

Our test boat required about 8x the amount of power that bike has available just to get on plane. Electric motors that powerful available today weigh about 150 pounds and cost several thousand dollars... new motors and new batteries are required to get a Superjet or SX-R working well enough to do what we do.

My sabbatical ended today, so we're back in the shop getting ready to get the next generation of motors and batteries into PWC's and into the water.

Alan Kroeper
Revolt Hydrosport

 

[Berky]

Alan , If you made the hull more efficient , it would take less energy to power it. My 25' panga in Panama will plane out with two people and only a 15 hp out board, sailboards can do 50 knots. I think a fly weight ,efficient, angle would be a good direction, untill a killer electric energy storage system pops up, but when it does , I'll be one of the first in line to get a controller/motor set up from you !

 

[kraqus]

Yeah that guy comes out of somewhere saying "he has" the patent for the electric jet ski....blah, blah, blah.....I thought that was the original guy mention at the beginning of this thread.

I second Berky....the minute something worth riding on top comes out, I will be also in line to get it. The way I see it in Cali pollution is the main reason to outlaw jet skis.

I know there are cool rangers out there and if they see you in a deserted beach doing your thing and knowing you will not be polluting the environment, they will be OK. The 200 yard still applies but like I said.....cool rangers on a deserted beach.

I know of a couple of spots like that around highway 1 (Cali location) that I can launch my ski from just need a good cart, perhaps a 4 wheeler to make it even easier.

That is all I want......drive 45 minutes and get my 2 hour fix.

Benny

 

[teton]

you could blow air in with an r/c duct fan then when the tether is pulled a servo closes the flap letting air in.... just an idea

brushless dc motors can be cooled using conduction....so they can be water cooled....no reason the motor cant be completely sealed

its really cool to see people experimenting with this....

 

[old-man-on-couch]

PWC power requirements vs. efficiency

That's definitely something I've been discussing with the other folks working on electric PWC's. Mostly, the hulls that are being tested with are pretty efficient, especially when you take 30-50 pounds off of them and put a lightweight rider on for testing.

The pumps are probably the biggest inefficiencies right now. It's quite hard to take a pump designed for peak efficiency at 160hp and tweak it to be efficient at 55hp, or to make it work efficiently at a dramatically different RPM.

Since our goal is to provide a re-power kit for existing hulls, we're locked into providing a similar amount of torque for existing hulls and pumps. We've been testing with the worst case scenario (Blaster2, 155 pump, lead-acid batteries, very heavy test rider) to ensure that our target audience isn't disappointed. We want to make a drive system that will work for anything from a 440 to an SX-R and a Superjet to a Blaster2, with stock pumps (probably a prop change) and without hull changes for weight or improving plane-out.

Basically, we figure most enthusiasts either have a spare hull or two, or have access to them. While an electric PWC may be "green", it's even "greener" to keep an old hull in the water and in use rather than cut up and in a landfill!


We'll leave making new electric PWC's to someone else. (for now...)

Alan Kroeper
Revolt Hydrosport

 

[the WaTeRhAwK]

brushless dc motors can be cooled using conduction....so they can be water cooled....no reason the motor cant be completely sealed

there's stuff spinning around in there, even though it's brushless, it's makin waves of transferable energy, it's gotta go somewhere. it's gotta breathe.

i think keeping water out of the electrics of the drivetrain is going to be the biggest issue.

 

[firemedicmonkey]

Very Excited about this project keep us updated...

 

[ATS_Aaron]

The pumps are probably the biggest inefficiencies right now. It's quite hard to take a pump designed for peak efficiency at 160hp and tweak it to be efficient at 55hp, or to make it work efficiently at a dramatically different RPM.

The 650 Superjet came with ~52hp and a 144 pump with a crappy impeller. With a decent impeller it gets on plane fast and will do about 42 mph.

I've been trying to understand impellers all summer long. It seems on a combustion engine you want a little bit of cavitation on the bottom so the engine can free rev into it's power band before the impeller fully loads it up.

Electric motors make tons of torque right off the bottom end, so you probably don't need that slack, or as much of it, right?

Since the electric motor power band is so linear are straight pitched impellers a better idea? or and I 100% off and we'll see the comeback of the huge GAP progressive impellers like 8/16's and 10/18's?

How dramatically different of an RPM range are you talking about?

I think the older skis are the ones to look at, ones that managed 50mph with 50hp gas engines. Make a Polaris kit, they have decently fun hulls and the older engines are ALL blown up, haha.

I'm pretty excited about this and have a SN hull I would like to "repower"

Aaron

 

[kraqus]

Here is yet another company that is manufacturing Electric Motorcycles, this one is based in Oregon:
http://www.brammo.com/home/

I like to see stuff like this. Things can only get smaller and more powerful....then waterproof....:biggrin:


[ame="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/34027036#34027036"]msnbc.com Video Player[/ame]



Benny

 

[the WaTeRhAwK]

how long does it take to charge?

 

[kraqus]

Are you asking about the Enertia bike?

http://www.brammo.com/learn/#specifications

Enertia Batteries
Battery Type: Valence Brand - Lithium Iron Phosphate*
Battery Pack Capacity: 3.1 kWh
Battery Pack Voltage: 76.8 V (nominal)
Recharge Time: Approximately 4 hours
Battery Life: 2,000 recharges


Benny