Other Where is jetskiing going?

B3IS

B3IS

Biker is a friend of mine and he is an inspiration for sure. I really dont think we need to worrry about the sport that we love it will be here for a long time to come.
 
Peter123

Peter123

C-Note
Location
Houston, TX
Next year, my afternoon zen ride is out of Smoofer's back yard - the lower San Jacinto River. A good day will be going there from work (call ahead to have ski put on the lift), grab my gear and head to the dock. The ski starts floating, I'll strap on my jacket and after a minute or so of warmup I'll head up river. I'll go about 10-12 miles up the river and then turn around and come back. SOme days I may run into wakeboard boats, other days it's calm as glass. But either way, I'll get a good 45 minute cruise of a ride, great scenery, and I get to go as slow or as fast as I want.... No waiting up, no hurrying up. Just me and the ski. By the time I get back, the sun is going down, I'll crack one of their beers and watch the sunset as Smoofer puts away my ski....

Perfect way to clear my head. Now I want to go ride...
 
WFO Speedracer

WFO Speedracer

A lifetime ban is like a lifetime warranty !
Location
Alabama
tom21 said:
I am not trying to bring things down, trust me I would hope only quality parts ever were made.

just as an example, I am molding an fx hull right now. So far its taken 12 yards of mat, 1 yard of 10 oz cloth, 6 gallons of resin and 12 man hours to just mold the bottom of the hull. its not done yet as its a 3 part mold due to the tubbies being built into the mold.

this does not include all the little things or the time and materials to modify the hull like we have. I still have to do the top and the hood and a bearing support. then I can begin to make the parts. dont forget time to sand and polish everything. its a huge investment.

I could have used a little better materials and I could definitely used worse(cheaper). not including all the time and materials to make the mold I hope in the end I will be just slightly higher in materials to lay up my hull than to buy a ski and mod the pump, add tubbies and widen the tray.

So if you "could" make a hull where the materials cost approximately what a stock hull with mods cost then the only thing left is the labor. I still have so much to do I havent even thought about a layup schedule or if I will bag it. but just for a point of reference using the mold numbers it would take approximately 25 hours just to lay glass. this is not including mold prep, cutting materials(sounds like nothing but it takes more time than you would think) popping and trimming parts. drilling all the holes for fittings.

we have seen all the builds and top deck swaps and that is what lies ahead. Not a very cheap propasition. I know I dont want to do it for 15 and hour. furthermore I cant afford to. this is assuming everything goes perfect lol. or that the builder knows what they are doing and if they are building the best possible product or just trying to pass it off as an affordable alternative. we have seen how that ends.

How many of us would be in this hobby if we had to pay 6K just to get a hull?

Im not scared though, cause if all that was out there was couches you can damn sure bet I would take a sawzall to it and carve me out a 4stroke superjet from that pig.
Click to expand...

The problem is you are looking at it from a Jet ski tech perspective, I don't know what your labor rate is but mine is $80.00 an hour and I am on the low side of scale. You have to look at this from a production standpoint, using that analogy you won't be paying your employees $80.00 an hour, you will be paying them maybe $10.00 an hour, at that rate 25 hours of labor is $250.00, materials will be much cheaper because you would be buying large quantities, 55 gallon drums of resin, giant rolls of cloth, etc etc.That kind of production facility would put the products in a more affordable range.:wiggle:
 
Matt_E

Matt_E

steals hub caps from cars
Site Supporter
Location
at peace
It would also greatly increase the overhead. And while you may be paying those guys only $10/hr, bet that hour would ultimately cost you quite a bit more.
And as a customer I'm not sure I'd want a hull laid up by minimum wage folk.

Jmho.

(secretly, I hope you're right)
 
OCD Solutions

OCD Solutions

Original, Clean and Dependable Solutions
Location
Rentz, GA
Matt_E said:
It would also greatly increase the overhead. And while you may be paying those guys only $10/hr, bet that hour would ultimately cost you quite a bit more.
And as a customer I'm not sure I'd want a hull laid up by minimum wage folk.

Jmho.

(secretly, I hope you're right)
Click to expand...

Good thing Rickter fans don't share that opinion. :biggrin:
 
Matt_E

Matt_E

steals hub caps from cars
Site Supporter
Location
at peace
Lol. (that's exactly the hull I was thinking of when I wrote that)

Too bad that the sweatshop manufacture doesn't reflect in the price of Rickters, eh?
 
S

shanes

Location
indonesia / Spain
OCD Solutions said:
Good thing Rickter fans don't share that opinion. :biggrin:
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i think you should go to the factory before you make a comment like that !!! if its good enough for Ferrari , Audi , Ducati , KTM etc etc etc its good enough for Rick to have his hulls produced there , the place is run by German and english guys with all the latest equipment there carbon is some of the best in the world .

i have been there many times a very good friend of mine used to run the place motorcycle dept , it a far cry from a 3 rd world sweat shop
 
OCD Solutions

OCD Solutions

Original, Clean and Dependable Solutions
Location
Rentz, GA
shanes said:
i think you should go to the factory before you make a comment like that !!! if its good enough for Ferrari , Audi , Ducati , KTM etc etc etc its good enough for Rick to have his hulls produced there , the place is run by German and english guys with all the latest equipment there carbon is some of the best in the world .

i have been there many times a very good friend of mine used to run the place motorcycle dept , it a far cry from a 3 rd world sweat shop
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Don't worry, I have industry sources too. I would not presume to make such a bold statement without factual data.

Don't get me wrong, I think Rick is doing great things but I just feel that his hulls could be of a higher standard for the $$ he is charging. Low production costs and bulk purchase of material should net a cheaper, stronger boat not a more expensive one.
 
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WFO Speedracer

WFO Speedracer

A lifetime ban is like a lifetime warranty !
Location
Alabama
Matt_E said:
It would also greatly increase the overhead. And while you may be paying those guys only $10/hr, bet that hour would ultimately cost you quite a bit more.
And as a customer I'm not sure I'd want a hull laid up by minimum wage folk.

Jmho.

(secretly, I hope you're right)
Click to expand...

So do you think the guys at the Ski Clinic laying up those Bob hulls are getting paid $80.00 an hour or is it closer to $10.00 dollars an hour ? I am thinking its a lot closer to $10.00 than it is to $80.00........................
 
Matt_E

Matt_E

steals hub caps from cars
Site Supporter
Location
at peace
I think you're right. But I also think the Rickter guys are probably getting paid even less, and that's certainly not reflecting in the price.
 
tom21

tom21

havin fun
Location
clearwater FL
I have already been down the "employee" route all last year and just cant seem to find anyone who can do what I want the way I want it. "good enough" is not my good enough. so it will remain a solo effort. Someday I may be able to design a process where anyone could fill my shoes but right now its not even a remote possibility. thats not to say I am perfect, just that I cant find too many people who can do what I do and do it for a price that works for me.

I know people that can make better parts than me but there would be no profit. been down that road before too and relying on someone else to come thru is no picnic either. so for me the only way to keep a constant quality and price is by my own hands and I am working on making improvements in quality and time.

I still dont see how things will ever get cheaper. unless a material is produced that will make a hull lighter, stronger and cheaper than what is currently available. til then we will all just keep pushing these envelopes we have.
 
tom21

tom21

havin fun
Location
clearwater FL
WFO Speedracer said:
The problem is you are looking at it from a Jet ski tech perspective, I don't know what your labor rate is but mine is $80.00 an hour and I am on the low side of scale. You have to look at this from a production standpoint, using that analogy you won't be paying your employees $80.00 an hour, you will be paying them maybe $10.00 an hour, at that rate 25 hours of labor is $250.00, materials will be much cheaper because you would be buying large quantities, 55 gallon drums of resin, giant rolls of cloth, etc etc.That kind of production facility would put the products in a more affordable range.:wiggle:
Click to expand...

this just creates different problems,
1. I dont have the money to buy material in bulk
2. somebody has to train the new employees, more time away from production with no guarantee of producing a quality part.
3. Now my time is devoted to putting out fires and overseeing production. so now my 80 an hour eats into that 70 dollar an hour profit margin.
4. you assumed( incorrectly) that there is 80 an hour profit on the parts. on some parts its not possible or not possible yet.
5 less experienced help makes more mistakes and more waste. what are we at like 25 an hour now?
6 need more space to have more employees working, and now my compressor is not up to it, plus I need more tools.
it goes on and on.

the only way I see this ever working is to grow with the growth, that takes time and effort. but really how long can you stay on top of the field? someone is always looking to blaze a new path, and constantly coming up with new things is not profitable either or always.

everyone thinks its soo easy to make stuff. WFO as you well know just because you make it and think its cool that does not mean it will sell like crazy.
 
freestylist69

freestylist69

Location
Qatar
Your right Tom. On top of that, REAL Carbon Fibre is a Natural source - like gas. So prices will keep stable, in other words, prices will keep increasing. .
 
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