- Location
- Central Wisconsin
Ooooo sassy. Anyways, is everybody running pump gas with the 964?
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Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Freestyle Affordable Power......... It's COMING
- Thread starter scottie mac
- Start date
makejetskiinggreatagain
Brandon
I would like to politely chime in here on typical R&D procedures that I have been a part of. And believe me JS/sj, I am not at all trying to bad mouth you at all. I just have some insight I think I can share with everyone because of my experiences.I've read every single post on this thread up to this page (67) as of right now. Its been several hours but this thread is better than any book I've ever read because this product seems so exciting! I plan to read the other 10 pages tonight.
Anyways, my career is in prototyping for an extremely large medical manufacturer. R&D is my life, and the type of R&D we do is some of the most highly regulated prototyping there is. In the medical world, a when a prototype is designed and made it is first tested in our lab in the beginning stages, long before anyone else ever gets their hands on it. We play with it, we tweak some things, we remake components, and we re test them in the lab. Sometimes we overhaul them. From what I read, Eric seemed to have done the same thing before anyone else got to play with his creation. For us, after lab testing confidently proves the result the product was designed for, our implants/instruments go into a phase of clinical trials in which appointed doctors use our product in patients who volunteer for a more experimental treatment. This would be where TPE enlisted the help of his friends, provided the motors, and testing was further completed within his trusted source of testers. Once this is done and extensive clinical data is gathered, a medical company can apply for a 510K clearance from the FDA. Other data considered by the FDA for this clearance is called "Equivalence Comparison", which would basically tell them our product is similar to already proven ones in some aspects, while these other aspects of the product are new. It also seems to me that TPE similarly tested these engines to exhaustion with their "clinical trials", and while many aspect of them I've read seemed to incorporate new engineering, a lot of the components seem to be based off of proven technology or "equivalence comparison". For us, the FDA will then approve our product because they are confident it is safe and unlikely to fail and it can be launched to paying customers. We call this the alpha launch. TPE, at page 67 at least since that's all I have read to at this very moment, would be in the "alpha launch" of their product. Once paying customers (i.e. doctors and patients for us) use our product, we still monitor the successes and failures and make further changes.
See, even in one of the most regulated industries in the world where companies invest millions into the development and TESTING of new products, there are unseen failures or improvements to be made that can only be learned through the customer base using the product. Despite zero failures or complaints mentioned from customers in this thread, TPE seems to be making slight adjustments. from what I have read, their product has been perfected to the utmost point that they can possibly perfect it to at this stage. I would personally have zero reservations about buying one of their engines and I trust that they have done all they can to provide the customer with the highest quality product they can. So, while I agree with you completely that customers should not be the R&D of a product like many companies have done to their customer base, I disagree that this is TPE's mindset or motivation. They have exhausted their testing from my eyes to the same level that many medical companies do, and I applaud them for it. And thanks to them, my meager machining wage just may allow me to venture into the big power playground one day
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NVJAY775
My home away from home.
- Location
- Gardnerville, Nevada, United States
Well said FPF.
I have to say I can't wait to upgrade my 964 and now that my son has rode it as well he is already saving up.
I also think some failures can happen due to owner set up and maintenance?
But! Eric was very interested in my setup prior to the install. He wanted everything to be as close to spot on as possible before I put it in the water. Philip Clemons AKA P&P Performance had a BIG hand in this process and the results are nothing short of amazing.
IMO anybody that purchases from TPE will be very pleased and will have excellent customer service in the end. They are a small company, with HUGE demand and not a whole lot of extra time on their hands. My communications went very well throughout the buying process.
It's impossible to keep everybody happy as there is always a rotten egg in every group unfortunately. But I have no doubts that if you get a TPE motor and set it up right, tune it right, treat it right, you will be very stoked with it.
tstewart - Your comments are a little sketchy sounding bro. If you can, get out and ride one and see if it's really something you want. If you're interested in a few, you should really make the time to check out these and others. Ride everything you can, so you have something to compare to. And don't hesitate to try motors in higher price ranges.
I have to say I can't wait to upgrade my 964 and now that my son has rode it as well he is already saving up.
I also think some failures can happen due to owner set up and maintenance?
But! Eric was very interested in my setup prior to the install. He wanted everything to be as close to spot on as possible before I put it in the water. Philip Clemons AKA P&P Performance had a BIG hand in this process and the results are nothing short of amazing.
IMO anybody that purchases from TPE will be very pleased and will have excellent customer service in the end. They are a small company, with HUGE demand and not a whole lot of extra time on their hands. My communications went very well throughout the buying process.
It's impossible to keep everybody happy as there is always a rotten egg in every group unfortunately. But I have no doubts that if you get a TPE motor and set it up right, tune it right, treat it right, you will be very stoked with it.
tstewart - Your comments are a little sketchy sounding bro. If you can, get out and ride one and see if it's really something you want. If you're interested in a few, you should really make the time to check out these and others. Ride everything you can, so you have something to compare to. And don't hesitate to try motors in higher price ranges.
- Location
- some where
Nvjay775... Set aside my abilities to ride, may be a newb... Or ex pro... does it matter? Sketchy? A post w/pic was posted with a question of information... A representative of tpe made an "odd" statement... They both disappeared... Screen shots are avaible for proof if any may desire. To me there is something weird going on...more like some deception. Not cool when you spend $$$ at this level..
Fpf. ..this ain't the same. You say they have had no failures or complaints? I don't believe that,or should I ?
Fpf. ..this ain't the same. You say they have had no failures or complaints? I don't believe that,or should I ?
- Location
- Harveys Lake PA
Regardless of what was posted or deleted I would imagine the issue has been resolved. That looks to be ARP hardware, identical to mine on my 1105. If a bolt broke I would blame that failure on over torquing or ARP's problem. I have the first 1105 Erik made, it has had zero issues. (Other than me chasing an issue with a bad epic) I understand your skepticism, go ride one, look at the customer service and how well they handle an issue and decide for yourself.
You can't make an honest evaluation of an engine through a keyboard..
Philip Clemmons
Owner, P&P Performance
- Location
- Richmond, Va
Ive tried pretty hard to stay out of this, but here's my .02 cents.........
There are many factors to consider when any part fails, from assembly, metallurgy, possible faulty contributing parts, etc. Could something vibrating due to alignment cause this, could the metal be bad, etc?
The first step should always be to analyze and contact the builder/supplier. Going straight to the Internet with photos of an issue that has unknown origin and placing it in the manufacturers thread is "less than ideal". Zimmy asked an honest question.......did you talk to TPE? Fair question. Maybe the OP realized he had no reason to put (what I would assume, but can't say for sure) a random, isolated incident out there at this point. I saw the pics. It was a broken stud. New stud and base gasket, 20 minutes time, and you're back to riding. There have been issues with every major engine manufacturer out there, and I have seen them all first hand. If you can't except that something might fail (like a simple bolt, pipe coupler, oring, etc, then stick to a stock piped 701!
We are running engines that are approaching 3 times the power level of stock.......failures will happen. A well known competitor with a major sponsorship ripped all of the studs out of his cases at world finals a year or two back, and was unable to compete. He didn't bad mouth the company. Everyone else felt bad for him, but no one faulted the engine builder. It happens every now and then. The good guys stand behind there product, and make changes if needed. At this power level, TPE's record is as good as any other engine manufacturer out there. Because he's new, people jump on the bashing band wagon. It's a bit childish. If it were brand x or y, customers would call and say "why'd this happen"? Because its a new builder, people make minor stuff out to be major.
At the end of the day a piece of hardware broke. I don't know anyone in the industry that hasn't dealt with a piece of broken hardware before. Get real guys.
There are many factors to consider when any part fails, from assembly, metallurgy, possible faulty contributing parts, etc. Could something vibrating due to alignment cause this, could the metal be bad, etc?
The first step should always be to analyze and contact the builder/supplier. Going straight to the Internet with photos of an issue that has unknown origin and placing it in the manufacturers thread is "less than ideal". Zimmy asked an honest question.......did you talk to TPE? Fair question. Maybe the OP realized he had no reason to put (what I would assume, but can't say for sure) a random, isolated incident out there at this point. I saw the pics. It was a broken stud. New stud and base gasket, 20 minutes time, and you're back to riding. There have been issues with every major engine manufacturer out there, and I have seen them all first hand. If you can't except that something might fail (like a simple bolt, pipe coupler, oring, etc, then stick to a stock piped 701!
We are running engines that are approaching 3 times the power level of stock.......failures will happen. A well known competitor with a major sponsorship ripped all of the studs out of his cases at world finals a year or two back, and was unable to compete. He didn't bad mouth the company. Everyone else felt bad for him, but no one faulted the engine builder. It happens every now and then. The good guys stand behind there product, and make changes if needed. At this power level, TPE's record is as good as any other engine manufacturer out there. Because he's new, people jump on the bashing band wagon. It's a bit childish. If it were brand x or y, customers would call and say "why'd this happen"? Because its a new builder, people make minor stuff out to be major.
At the end of the day a piece of hardware broke. I don't know anyone in the industry that hasn't dealt with a piece of broken hardware before. Get real guys.
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Well said!
^ exactly. I race cars and have for years. when we blow up an engine, we don't insinuate a wrong doing or tragic design flaw. We meet with the builder, figure out how it happened, make improvements, try it again. We do this because when it's running, it's running damn good. We are getting an advantage. It comes with a price, and collectively driver, team, and builder work together to make improvements.
These are bad ass motors in a non commercial sport. We are lucky to have them. Well, you guys are... hope to get one for myself some day
These are bad ass motors in a non commercial sport. We are lucky to have them. Well, you guys are... hope to get one for myself some day
skinnyman
YOU CANT RENT MY SKI
- Location
- Dallas/ToyBox
I have about 50 gallons thru my 1105 no issues
I can say this if you are jumping into the big motor scene expect issues down the road.
I have run Team Scream,Dasa,TPE They all fail its the nature of the beast If your not ready for that reality STAY STOCK
I can say this if you are jumping into the big motor scene expect issues down the road.
I have run Team Scream,Dasa,TPE They all fail its the nature of the beast If your not ready for that reality STAY STOCK
Its not about stay stock dont go big bla bla...the thing is this guy posted a picture of what happened to him but we obviously knew it was his fault for not torquing correctly but that was HIS problem not a problem with the tpe but why did zimmy basically tell him he needed permission to post the picture he did?
As Phil said, I asked if said customer contacted TPE prior to posting pics about the issue... That is all I asked @River Rat. You are twisting what I said.
I actually know what you said. But why delete it then? Im not twisting anything I have a picture of the posts that were deleted and if ya wanna say im twisting things? All im saying is IIIIIIi could tell it was the customers fault and there was no need to delete his picture and I know the way u asked if he contacted tpe before he posted but why delete ur post then?
I deleted it because it was part of a conversation that didnt exist anymore.... It was a post standing alone by itself, it looked a little out of place, no?
It sounds like I should be the one asking you for permission to delete or edit my posts... which I would say as of right now I don't have permission...
It sounds like I should be the one asking you for permission to delete or edit my posts... which I would say as of right now I don't have permission...
This is the X, not pwctoday. I have the ability to edit my posts, if something no longer applies, or something has changed, I can go back and adjust what was said, as necessary.
To go forward from here, the biggest question to be asked when something is posted like yesterday is "What is the reason?".
Did you go to the source first or come to the forum for "help". If your pizza had pepperoni instead of sausage do you go to the forum to get it corrected or do you call the pizza place up. So what is the real reason to come to the forum with these types of "questions"? Publicity or answers...... Many times people are posting out of anger or frustration.
To go forward from here, the biggest question to be asked when something is posted like yesterday is "What is the reason?".
Did you go to the source first or come to the forum for "help". If your pizza had pepperoni instead of sausage do you go to the forum to get it corrected or do you call the pizza place up. So what is the real reason to come to the forum with these types of "questions"? Publicity or answers...... Many times people are posting out of anger or frustration.
Philip Clemmons
Owner, P&P Performance
- Location
- Richmond, Va
Do you make it a habit of screen shotting every post with a pic and then causing drama? It seems to me that your behavior is what's sketchy.
What are your motives? What are you accomplishing here?
If you have questions call TPE and speak with Erik. He'll gladly answer your questions.
Nope, just had a feeling something wasnt gonna go right after that posts was made by zimmy then sure enough the picture was deleted but like I said Im moving on. No motives i just been wanting a tpe motor but im on the fence of purchasing now or later , need for drama.
- Location
- some where
Well...??.. so much to consider...say... But...
WHY speak ? To try and be helpful to all and lend information that is truthful. Am I angry? Not really(not at tpe) but still sore at a few in here that burned me for 4700$(u no who u r!)
Phillip- u must b kidding@20min repair,back on water .if that stud broke flush with case(lookd to b) ss doesn't drill easy... I see many hrs of repair,may not come out good?? And cause of break?? Blame on customers over torque? Back up, if tpe assemble,an at sometime that stud had been "stressed ,flexed @that break point" who's fault is it???? The 6 studs must align w/cyl.indexing.
With all the "tpe bandwagon" words... I just ...wonder about customers service...all this dosent seem to fit with commen sense.... All posts of"no problems"and now deleted problem...
WHY speak ? To try and be helpful to all and lend information that is truthful. Am I angry? Not really(not at tpe) but still sore at a few in here that burned me for 4700$(u no who u r!)
Phillip- u must b kidding@20min repair,back on water .if that stud broke flush with case(lookd to b) ss doesn't drill easy... I see many hrs of repair,may not come out good?? And cause of break?? Blame on customers over torque? Back up, if tpe assemble,an at sometime that stud had been "stressed ,flexed @that break point" who's fault is it???? The 6 studs must align w/cyl.indexing.
With all the "tpe bandwagon" words... I just ...wonder about customers service...all this dosent seem to fit with commen sense.... All posts of"no problems"and now deleted problem...