Hull Reinforcement...PICS!

[kraqus]

I have been doing a LOT of reading, bookmarking and printing some of the Hull reinforcements treads. Someone said in here, "You can only read so much before you try it".....I think I have read enough and I am ready to hack it.

So I walked into the local TAP Plastics store to buy some of the materials and I just happened to ask the guy at the counter some questions and He asked me what exactly I was doing, I said reinforcing a Jet ski Hull. He proceeded to explained a bunch of technical stuff and ended up pointing to a different type of resin.


TAP Marine Vinyl-Ester Resin:
http://www.tapplastics.com/shop/product.php?pid=34

He also suggested to apply 2 layers of cloth and a layer of this Mat in between the fiberglass cloth:

Baltek Mat T-2000:
http://www.tapplastics.com/shop/product.php?pid=93&


The thing is that this guy had samples to show me and I was Impressed. One piece of cloth and resin alone is VERY flexible. 2 pieces of cloth with the Baltek math sandwiched between is UNBELIEVABLE Strong.....for real.

After I tried to make my case on the Epoxy resin, He laughed and stated...."Vinyl Resin is THE resin to be used on that type of Hulls, the guys that referred you to buy the other type of Epoxy probably do not have access to vinyl where they live, blah, blah...."

I am a bit confused.....

Will Vinyl Resin work when reinforcement the Hull? Is it better as He suggested? What about the Baltek Mat? I have not seen you guys talking about it....I have seen some of you apply several layers of Cloth.....Does that gives you the same results as using this type of Mat?

What are your thoughts?



Kraqus

 

[Moto360]

The Vinyl-Ester Resin may adhere OK to the top deck of a superjet but may not adhere very well to the bottom deck which is SMC. Sheet Molded Compound. I went through the same thing with a guy near me. Started talking over my head and being real technical. He didn't really want to help me. I did get out of him that you had to know what material you had that you were trying to glue to. I used Epoxy Resin and I bought it from US Composits. They are on the net. One layer of 17 oz Biaxial and a layer of 6 oz carbon. Worked great and has been on there for over a year.

http://www.uscomposites.com/

Moto360

 

[Cannibal]

I have some of that mat. Very rigid stuff when laminated, and it does not soak up resin (very light/strong lamination). I plan on using it in my tray. I really had not considered using it on my sides, but you might run into clearance issues with a B pipe if you do.

 

[kraqus]

I have some of that mat. Very rigid stuff when laminated, and it does not soak up resin (very light/strong lamination). I plan on using it in my tray. I really had not considered using it on my sides, but you might run into clearance issues with a B pipe if you do.

YES it is. One thing is to read and see pics of people's builds and another is to actually see the glass layers and feel the different levels of strength the provide. He handed me 2 layers of 6oz cloth and that mat sandwiched in between and the thing was SO STRONG.


Engine is out !!!

I will be grinding some ribs soon....




Da rookie.

 

[kraqus]

Removed the pole and cables and all the hoses.
Superjet took a bath....
Uh!...Now ready to tackle the ribs.....

 

[Speedfreak]

So what resin are you going with?

I have read somewhere that the polyester will stick to polyester and the vinylester will stick to most things but is the best for layup when sticking to itself and the epoxy will stick to anything.

But I took my old ski to a fiberglass shop years ago to have a hole fixed and he used polyester on the SMC (before I knew anything about skis) and it held for years until I sold it. And I wasn't easy on it

 

[kraqus]

I a placing an order right now with uscomposites. I am going with Epoxy Resin 4:1 Fast cure Kit. Now I am trying to decide what Cloth to add to the order. My earlier comment about the Mat has been answered.

I am going to use Biax, which is a mix of cloth on one side and....Mat? on the other? Actually it does not look like the Mat but it has a cushy felling to it so it will definitely provide more strength. I am thinking about using 2 layers of it but I am not sure about the size (oz)......what do you think? 2 layers of 12 oz Biax? sounds good?

Kraqus

 

[stanton]

this a surf boat?

 

[kraqus]

this a surf boat?

Yeah.....with the EnviroNAZIS here in the bay area, we do not get to ride the surf.....you know....outlawed. But I do make it to Pismo as often as I can, so yes I want to reinforce for surf.....but we do get to chase boats, that is Tug boats in the Bay....quite a wake I should say and big air. Hey we got to find a way to entertain ourselves..... ;-)

I will be in Pismo this Friday Morning. I am bringing my Stock SN.



Kraqus

 

[stanton]

2 layers of 12oz knytex should do the job. get some microballons and fine chopped strand. grind out the exess green glue fill the bondline all the way around with peanut butter thick resin/filler. also fill under the hood lip. while the filller is still wet lay the glass on top and continue around the hull.
start with the nose, then the pole bracket area, then the sides.

 

[kraqus]

Yes, I read that is better to apply the Fiberglass while the "peanut butter" still fresh. While I do understand the concept of chemical bonding, I am worried that I will not be able to press the glass as firm as I would like with the rollers hence bubbles, because the filler may give in.......I guess I will have to be extra careful.....

I just placed my order including the 12oz Biax. I will post details of it later.

Kraqus

 

[stanton]

your over thinkin. its alot easier than your expecting. the rollers will help remove exess resin, but you dont want to remove all the resin.
also look into resin dyes if you want to clean up the engine compartment at the same time. black will give a carbon fiber look.

 

[Cannibal]

If you really want the Carbon look (without the cost), go with black dye and get the 2x2twill e-glass that UScomposites has, they call it "Industry Style 7725"

 

[kraqus]

Today was Rib's day. I nuked them all :rocketwhore: using a grinder. It wasn't that bad at all, grinding the ribs that is, but the Glue.....Oh what a PITA. There were Chunks of it in some areas, specially in the nose area. I removed enough glue so that if I run a plastic spatula on the bondline at an angle between both decks, the glue does not come close to touching the spatula. I will spread the "Peanut Butter" there and I want to make sure whatever left over glue is covered completely with that stuff.

I also sanded both decks as you can probably see in the pictures. The upper deck does not have that glossy look anymore, it's all scratched up. I use 60 grit and it got the job done quick. I have fiberglass up my butt now......LOL!! I think this will work fine for the epoxy to get a good grip on it. I washed the entire bilge and now is drying.

I am waiting for my Order to arrive from Uscomposites. Tracking number says Monday......:Banane01:

Like I said, it wasn't that bad at all, but my back and arms were killing me at times. You MUST wear a mask, and I mean a good one, a respirator, not the Hospital type. Also protect your eyes, all it takes is a tiny particle to mess you up.


I am ready for the glass......Cheer me on ! :cheer2:

Benny

 

[kraqus]

FAAAAAK !!!

Not everything went smooth today.
While removing the engine mounts, one of the bolts broke and 3/4 of it was left still in there. You can see it in the picture.


Got any ideas how to remove that sucker?

Benny

 

[superjet805]

It looks like there is still some sticking out. Just use vice grips and penetrating oil. If not, center punch it and then drill a small pilot hole in the broken bolt. I use left handed drill bits because sometimes you get lucky and the bit will pull it out. Drill the largest hole in the bolt you can without damaging the threads in the mount. Then, use an easy out. You can buy them at any automotive part store. Do not break the easy out off in the bolt! They are super hard and if it breaks off in there you can't drill it out.

 

[Dustin Mustangs]

Or cut a slot in it with a rotary tool and use a flat bladed screw driver...

And about the wet filler and roller for the mat... I would suggest using a squeegee in that area, if not all. You'll have no problem getting the excess resin out with it and, if you use it in a path perpendicular to the bond line, it will make the transition from top deck to filler to bottom deck one perfectly smooth curve. Not only will that look best, but it will give you the most strength, all else equal.

 

[kraqus]

I got all the materials on Monday as expected but we are having a heat wave at the moment in NORCAL and it is a PITA to work outside. I don't have a garage where I can work on my skis so I do it outside.....I think I will start next week as the Temps are going down a bit. Uscomposites.com is a great company to deal with.

Did you know they call me back to get the order straight?
I entered the wrong part number and someone caught that, so they call me to make sure it was right, of course it wasn't so they rectify it. Also their prices are great....I would definitely recommend them.....

Question,
Did I get the right rollers?
I mean look at it, it has treads.
Is that right?
The point is to get bubbles out, right?
I would expect a flat roller instead.

BTW: Thanks to everyone for their input.....much appreciated.




Benny

 

[MDStandUp]

Hey, how did it turn out? Curious cause im about to get into the same thing. Did you use everything that is showed in the picture. Meaning was that enough resin etc, or way too much. Also how much Biax did you buy? The reason i ask is because im planning on doing my SJ (plus trey) and my B1 at the same time. Just trying to get a feel for what i will and wont need.

 

[MADMAT]

I know this is old but I was watching HD TV:Boston Whaler.

They use the mat in between glass and they use actual rollers to roll resin....not that thing ^^^ up there.

It was pretty cool watching it.....chopper guns and technique and stuff.

If you know a little before watching it you can pick up a lot.....and quickly.