- Location
- dunedin, florida
thank you for your 2 cents but why would it not work on my ski what would it do or not do:dunno: i understand it works better on larger motors why?
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"PowerFactor" Dry Pipe
- Thread starter IKSTEJ
- Start date
thank you for your 2 cents but why would it not work on my ski what would it do or not do:dunno: i understand it works better on larger motors why?
Until we hear/see some real world tests from normal people (not companies trying to sell them for $1300), nobody will really know.
There is one here in Louisville that might be on the water tomorrow on a Lamey PV engine, hopefully we'll get it running and ride it tomorrow.
There is one here in Louisville that might be on the water tomorrow on a Lamey PV engine, hopefully we'll get it running and ride it tomorrow.
parrdaddy
No he will not!
- Location
- always be a TEXAN!
Rev Up
PFP
- Location
- Melbourne Beach
I want to give everyone on this forum an insight to PFP and the PowerFactor SJ Freestyle Exhaust system.
This exhaust system is designed to be used on superstock engine setup’s (800, 900, 1000, 1100). Over the last several years, many engine builders have been designing bigger freestyle engines, IE Stroke, Bore, Exhaust Valves, and Etc. The only piece that remains the same is the “B” pipe. Don’t get me wrong, the “B” pipe is a great all around pipe for stock and slightly modified engines, but it was never designed for maximum HP or Torque. It was originally designed to make a 20 hp increase on a stock Yamaha 701 SJ. On superstock engines the “B” pipe signs off quick. I’m not going into details, I will explain it in simple terms. It is about the powerband. Todays top freestyle riders are using the midrange to launch. Once you get into the midrange and rev out…..Hold on. It may take a little adjustment to get use to riding this powerband.
Design: The perfect pipe would be a straight pipe if you could fit into a ski. The more bends and the tighter the bends, the more HP you lose. There is no current dry pipe you can use that allows you to run exhaust valves because they go up and around the engine. The PFP pipe allows easy access to all engine parts and has minimal bends.
Fuel Tank: You can use a 2 gallon fuel tank on the Yamaha SJ. This allows for 30-40 minutes of riding time. If you are making a lot of HP, any rider will tell you after a 30 minute session, you need a break. It takes 30 seconds to refuel. You kinda get use to it. It is also about the weight. Three to four gallons of fuel is a lot of weight.
Engine Tuning: Anytime you make more HP, you have to make the appropriate adjustments, IE Ignition Timing, Fuel, possible Impeller changes, ETC. Every superstock is different according to the engine builder. Remember everything has to be right from the time the air enters the flame arrestors to the time the exhaust exits the rear of the ski.
Production: PFP exhaust, are manufactured at Factory Pipe. We have never had a failure after running these exhaust systems for 3 years
Cost: No they are not the cheapest pipe. Anybody in the production business will tell you it’s about qty. PFP is not producing 1000 at a time. We manufacture 50 at a time.
Dyno: I would not even think about dynoing a “B” pipe on a superstock engine. Been there……done that….10 years ago. The dyno is a great place to develop a new tune spec for a pipe, but you cannot duplicate the way it runs on the water (off idle and mid range). You have to adjust the tune spec for the powerband you want “on the water” Bottomline. Let the ride speak for itself.
I did not write this to start any arguments. Everybody is entitled to their own opinions. I am only speaking from my own experience.
I want to thank every aftermarket company (X-metal, EME, Waterdawg, and all others) for contributing to future of freestyle and freeride. The sport is moving in the right direction.
PowerFactorProducts.com website is coming soon.
Mark
When defying gravity…………..Horsepower to weight ratio
This exhaust system is designed to be used on superstock engine setup’s (800, 900, 1000, 1100). Over the last several years, many engine builders have been designing bigger freestyle engines, IE Stroke, Bore, Exhaust Valves, and Etc. The only piece that remains the same is the “B” pipe. Don’t get me wrong, the “B” pipe is a great all around pipe for stock and slightly modified engines, but it was never designed for maximum HP or Torque. It was originally designed to make a 20 hp increase on a stock Yamaha 701 SJ. On superstock engines the “B” pipe signs off quick. I’m not going into details, I will explain it in simple terms. It is about the powerband. Todays top freestyle riders are using the midrange to launch. Once you get into the midrange and rev out…..Hold on. It may take a little adjustment to get use to riding this powerband.
Design: The perfect pipe would be a straight pipe if you could fit into a ski. The more bends and the tighter the bends, the more HP you lose. There is no current dry pipe you can use that allows you to run exhaust valves because they go up and around the engine. The PFP pipe allows easy access to all engine parts and has minimal bends.
Fuel Tank: You can use a 2 gallon fuel tank on the Yamaha SJ. This allows for 30-40 minutes of riding time. If you are making a lot of HP, any rider will tell you after a 30 minute session, you need a break. It takes 30 seconds to refuel. You kinda get use to it. It is also about the weight. Three to four gallons of fuel is a lot of weight.
Engine Tuning: Anytime you make more HP, you have to make the appropriate adjustments, IE Ignition Timing, Fuel, possible Impeller changes, ETC. Every superstock is different according to the engine builder. Remember everything has to be right from the time the air enters the flame arrestors to the time the exhaust exits the rear of the ski.
Production: PFP exhaust, are manufactured at Factory Pipe. We have never had a failure after running these exhaust systems for 3 years
Cost: No they are not the cheapest pipe. Anybody in the production business will tell you it’s about qty. PFP is not producing 1000 at a time. We manufacture 50 at a time.
Dyno: I would not even think about dynoing a “B” pipe on a superstock engine. Been there……done that….10 years ago. The dyno is a great place to develop a new tune spec for a pipe, but you cannot duplicate the way it runs on the water (off idle and mid range). You have to adjust the tune spec for the powerband you want “on the water” Bottomline. Let the ride speak for itself.
I did not write this to start any arguments. Everybody is entitled to their own opinions. I am only speaking from my own experience.
I want to thank every aftermarket company (X-metal, EME, Waterdawg, and all others) for contributing to future of freestyle and freeride. The sport is moving in the right direction.
PowerFactorProducts.com website is coming soon.
Mark
When defying gravity…………..Horsepower to weight ratio
We can give some valuable information about setup to whoever has one.
There are a few tricks to getting the real snap out of it.
They can contact me directly. I'd be happy to help.
And I agree its going to take some people actually experiencing the gain to verify our evaluation.
2lick
Brap!!!
- Location
- Limerick, PA
Awesome! Thanks for getting on and posting this info...
RiverRat
.......
- Location
- Louisville, Ky
I will probably give you a call in a couple days pat. I am going to run the pipe on a Standard stroke lamey PV (85.5mm bore) tomorrow but want to get some time on the water and make adjustments. I can already tell the motor wants to rev harder in the mid range just by running it on the trailer. Sounds better already but starting small as far as tunning. Stock CDI and flywheel to begin with.
Mark,
Thank you for the great info!! I ordered your dry pipe system through Patrick the other day, and I look forward to using it on my build with Bobby and Patrick. Your a true asset to the sport my friend!!
-Scott
scottie mac
X-
Mark,
If it is best to keep the pipe as straight as possible, why didn't you make it go farther up in the hull? I would think that would allow a larger tank. I understand that you can run for 30 minutes on a 2 gallon tank, but some people have long rides to get to where they like actually ride. It looks like there is room to make the pipe stretch out farther.
Just wondering.
Scottie
If it is best to keep the pipe as straight as possible, why didn't you make it go farther up in the hull? I would think that would allow a larger tank. I understand that you can run for 30 minutes on a 2 gallon tank, but some people have long rides to get to where they like actually ride. It looks like there is room to make the pipe stretch out farther.
Just wondering.
Scottie
Kennay
Squarenose for the _____
- Location
- Myrtle Beach, SC
my question exactly Scott (Though I didn't ask)
I'd assume it was to keep the weight as far back as possible though.
I'd assume it was to keep the weight as far back as possible though.
Superjetjim
X-
Perhaps if they extended the header pipe it might change the 'return wave' in the pipe? - I recall in my model aircraft days when we ran pipes the length of the header pipe before the chamber moved the power band up (shorter header) or down/torque (longer header) I guess water injection throws this theory to the wind>
Big Kahuna
Administrator
- Location
- Tuscaloosa, AL
remember what he said about sharper turns. To go forward more would require a much sharper turn back. Possible power loss.
Keep in mind, this pipe is designed more for freestyle. Long ride times are not an issue for just that type of riding. If you want power that is closer to this, just get a Type 9.
Until someone comes out with at least a 3-3.5 gallon tank, I think the market is going to be very very limited on this pipe.
When we do the General Jackson ride in Nashville, it's almost a full tank for both sessions. I ran 2 tanks last month when I went, and was sucking some air at the end of each. 2 gallons wouldn't even get you downtown from the launch.
When we do the General Jackson ride in Nashville, it's almost a full tank for both sessions. I ran 2 tanks last month when I went, and was sucking some air at the end of each. 2 gallons wouldn't even get you downtown from the launch.
- Location
- Lake Havasu City, AZ USA
Another thing to think about if you compete in the Amateur 1 class (stock hull/length, 800cc limit,etc), you have to run a OEM fuel tank:
28.4.4 Fuel Tank – Amateur Freestyle Class I: Fuel tank must be OEM as supplied by the OEM manufacturer. An OEM fuel tank is the only tank that can be used to supply fuel to the engine.
Amateur 2 class(aftermarket hull/900cc,etc) can run aftermarket tanks.
I'm going to email them(APBA and Frazier IJSBA) about this and see if it cant get changed.
I know there are peeps now in Am 1 class that run a aftermarket fuel tank and it should not matter what tank you run as long as its safe and secure.
Last time I emailed and explained about relocating the fuel filler and why this is done, they changed the rule book to allow it.
28.4.4 Fuel Tank – Amateur Freestyle Class I: Fuel tank must be OEM as supplied by the OEM manufacturer. An OEM fuel tank is the only tank that can be used to supply fuel to the engine.
Amateur 2 class(aftermarket hull/900cc,etc) can run aftermarket tanks.
I'm going to email them(APBA and Frazier IJSBA) about this and see if it cant get changed.
I know there are peeps now in Am 1 class that run a aftermarket fuel tank and it should not matter what tank you run as long as its safe and secure.
Last time I emailed and explained about relocating the fuel filler and why this is done, they changed the rule book to allow it.
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2lick
Brap!!!
- Location
- Limerick, PA
Agreed...
And no we don't want a fancy 600 dollar carbon one.... just something to hold 3-3.5.... Then I can ride to my riding spot on the lake and at least have 30min-1h to ride.....
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It's around 1.75" probably, but the resonator is even smaller inside. Very interesting design.
- Location
- Lake Orion, Michigan
This gas tank issue has been beaten to death... yes we know.
People who order (like myself) I'm sure are well aware of not being able to run a OEM tank.
Frankly it looks like Power Factor is not looking to sell this pipe to the masses, only a smaller market, of whom most of those people know what they want and why. Doesn't look like they will be modifying the pipe to allow the OEM to be used.
People who order (like myself) I'm sure are well aware of not being able to run a OEM tank.
Frankly it looks like Power Factor is not looking to sell this pipe to the masses, only a smaller market, of whom most of those people know what they want and why. Doesn't look like they will be modifying the pipe to allow the OEM to be used.
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waxhead
wannabe backflipper
- Location
- gold coast
I love the idea of this pipe i would love one in my race boat
but the issue of not be allowed to use aftermarket tanks knocks it out for me
it would make things so much easier to work on withthe pipe laid flat
but the issue of not be allowed to use aftermarket tanks knocks it out for me
it would make things so much easier to work on withthe pipe laid flat