RE-confirming that refoaming is the worst job - UPDATE post 181

[douglee25]

Why doesn't Steve just send you a new set, thicker like suggested above, at no charge? In other words, why do you have to send him your old set? They're already trashed, there's no sense in him fixing them. Just have Steve whip you up a new set.

What do you say Steve?

Doug

 

[crammit442]

Being the first guy to install footholds or reading more posts about installing footholds doesn't mean your doing it right or an authority on the subject.

BTW BK, my footholds are the same thickness as wammers.

I weight 230lbs , can plate to plate a roll and my footholds in Whitney are still as strong as the day I installed them almost 5 years ago.

That's 100% true. There are lots of people here that have doing things the wrong way for longer than anyone else. That said, I agreed with Kenneth that the install looked shoddy in the pics posted yesterday. After being referred to the original pics, it's clear there was nothing wrong with what Darin did in his install. I personally don't like the use of 5200 because it potentially leaves a small area where the epoxy will not be bonding directly to glass.

there you go! the bi-axial is on on the edge of the foothold where it still has support from the pump cavity. You need it to go inside the hold all the way to the back inside of the holds, that is where their is no support underneath (except maybe some foam maybe)

Nothing personal, but what you've just admitted, whether you meant to or not is that the holds are made too thin. If the customer is required to use glass for purposes other than securing them to the hull, then the product is clearly not made strong enough. What that means to me is that they need more wall thickness or a more sophisticated layup schedule to be sufficient. If they're strong enough ONLY where they rest on existing glass then in essence what the customer is required to do is finish building your(WCF) part. Essentially what you've done is stop a couple of glass layers short of a finished foothold.:nono:

 

[douglee25]

Nothing personal, but what you've just admitted, whether you meant to or not is that the holds are made too thin. If the customer is required to use glass for purposes other than securing them to the hull, then the product is clearly not made strong enough. What that means to me is that they need more wall thickness or a more sophisticated layup schedule to be sufficient. If they're strong enough ONLY where they rest on existing glass then in essence what the customer is required to do is finish building your(WCF) part. Essentially what you've done is stop a couple of glass layers short of a finished foothold.:nono:

100% correct.

I was sitting here pondering and thinking to myself, what is the point of purchasing these footholds if you have to add more fiberglass to make the foothold thicker? You're basically using the foothold as a form vs. using it as a finished product to install.

Doug

 

[SuperJETT]

Just finished grinding down both sides of the foothold and laid 2 layers of 15 ounce biax on the back to make it a whole foothold again (2 pieces broke off while grinding). I'll let that set up overnight then put one layer on the inside before putting it back on and using Great Stuff to get me by this summer.

I'm not sure if I'm going to do the left foothold or not, it's not broken yet. I'll see how strong it feels before deciding.

The hold that broke doesn't even feel as thick as one layer of my 15ounce where it broke, other portions seem a little thicker but not much, however it's all just random matting, not woven cloth.


Crammit: I only put the 3M in between the flange and the hull as a waterproofing barrier, none of it makes it to the edge where the fiberglass bonds. I screw the foothold in first with the 3M, let that set up, remove the screws and glass it in for the permanent bond. This foothold just slid right out after cutting the glass, because the 3M and foam bonded to the spray paint on the back and it released from the foothold. Since there was no bond there, the inner portion could move slightly against the compression of the foam and eventually fatigued and broke.

 

[hangtime]

5200 is not as good as epoxy so anywhere you used that will be weaker than the glass .i'm not saying it was done worng but if you want it to be as good as it gets you use all epoxy .

Steve offered to replace them so you should have taken him up on the offer and you would have had them by now .

 

[SuperJETT]

5200 is not as good as epoxy so anywhere you used that will be weaker than the glass .i'm not saying it was done worng but if you want it to be as good as it gets you use all epoxy .

Steve offered to replace them so you should have taken him up on the offer and you would have had them by now .

It just broke Wed. night and I just dug into it yesterday afternoon, how would I have had them already?

 

[hangtime]

It just broke Wed. night and I just dug into it yesterday afternoon, how would I have had them already?

Steve would have flown them over to your place in the waterfreak private jet .

 

[ski4]

he did offer
and the biggest gripe on here is people not allowing a manufacturer or dealer a chance to make things right.

hell, i am critical of some companies for sure. and i can be relentless in my criticism. see any of my negative feedbacks. but steve did offer to make it right . the bashing i feel is unfair here. a poor design is one thing for certain . but if he is going to make good on it?

darin i can understand fully your frustration , and it's deserved. i mean really well deserved. i have two kids , and dj and the crew can attest to how my ride time has become limited since they arrived. i would be upset too. but you also seem to be more level headed and collected than me too.

my dego temper can get the best of me.

anyhow that's my piece and 2 cents, i just would like to see this thread remain informative!

 

[WaveDemon]

Steve would have flown them over to your place in the waterfreak private jet .

and installed them himself and left you a case of beer for the inconvenience.

 

[SuperJETT]

Here's the deal, Steve says they need to be reinforced, so even if he did send me another set, they're really more of a form for my own fiberglass. I have that in these already, so I'd just be wasting time/money shipping these to him and waiting on new ones when I could be glassing them up properly like I am.

What I don't appreciate is him blaming it on me, first saying there wasn't any foam underneath which there was, then saying I didn't run fiberglass all the way in, which I shouldn't have to do, not to mention the paint on back prevented the foam and 3M from bonding to the actual fiberglass.

I'm done arguing, gonna eat some dinner then get back out to the garage while my wife/kids are visiting friends an hour away.

This should have never been an issue.

 

[waterfreak]

Steve would have flown them over to your place in the waterfreak private jet .

:haha::haha::haha:

you know, I offered to replace them but I was continiously told that 24/7 was far superior and thicker . I want to make it right , but a simple phone call or e-mail ,instead of posting it up , would of facilitated the process.

Should I fire up the turbines :drive:

 

[ski4]

Here's the deal, Steve says they need to be reinforced, so even if he did send me another set, they're really more of a form for my own fiberglass. I have that in these already, so I'd just be wasting time/money shipping these to him and waiting on new ones when I could be glassing them up properly like I am.

I'm done arguing, gonna eat some dinner then get back out to the garage while my wife/kids are visiting friends an hour away.

This should have never been an issue.

agree 100% it's just the bashing you two did on each other that bums me out

and at least you will be dialed in soon!!! woo hooo :friday:

 

[SuperJETT]

:haha::haha::haha:

you know, I offered to replace them but I was continiously told that 24/7 was far superior and thicker . I want to make it right , but a simple phone call or e-mail ,instead of posting it up , would of facilitated the process.

Should I fire up the turbines :drive:

Replacing them with the same thing, still requiring reinforcement, and still requiring tons of work on my part, new turf/padding/fiberglass/resin/etc.

This should have never been an issue, and there's not really anything you could do to 'make it right' other than fixing my ski for me, here, which I know is out of the question.

I'm just not happy, and I'm sure Hunter isn't happy about having a bloody toe from it either.

 

[ski4]

:haha::haha::haha:

you know, I offered to replace them but I was continiously told that 24/7 was far superior and thicker . I want to make it right , but a simple phone call or e-mail ,instead of posting it up , would of facilitated the process.

Should I fire up the turbines :drive:

i can see him posting the facts and you getting to retort steve. then take it to phone or email.

:bigok:

 

[crammit442]

agree 100% it's just the bashing you two did on each other that bums me out

and at least you will be dialed in soon!!! woo hooo :friday:

Dude.....it's the internet. Why would you even for one second be personally bummed because two people you barely know in person are arguing online. :thinking:

 

[WFO Speedracer]

:haha::haha::haha:

you know, I offered to replace them but I was continiously told that 24/7 was far superior and thicker . I want to make it right , but a simple phone call or e-mail ,instead of posting it up , would of facilitated the process.

Should I fire up the turbines :drive:

Personally I don't know how anyone does business with persons on this website,I have pretty much given up any hope of doing so.I can damn well bet you if the footholds were thicker some sunny beach would come on here and complain that they were too thick and requierd massive amounts of glassing and fairing because they didn't flex when they were screwed down,you can argue that point all you want but deep down you know its the truth.:hitwithrock::thumbsdown:

 

[750SX]

Steve, I ran one sheet of 1708 the whole length of the tray into the bottoms of the holds. Also I am positive that there is foam underneath the hold. Will this be enough to prevent mine from cracking?

 

[waterfreak]

Steve, I ran one sheet of 1708 the whole length of the tray into the bottoms of the holds. Also I am positive that there is foam underneath the hold. Will this be enough to prevent mine from cracking?

yes, yes ,yes:bananapowerslide:

 

[750SX]

yes, yes ,yes:bananapowerslide:

Nice. I have lightweight rider technology on my side too hahaha!

 

[waterfreak]

Personally I don't know how anyone does business with persons on this website,I have pretty much given up any hope of doing so.I can damn well bet you if the footholds were thicker some sunny beach would come on here and complain that they were too thick and requierd massive amounts of glassing and fairing because they didn't flex when they were screwed down,you can argue that point all you want but deep down you know its the truth.:hitwithrock::thumbsdown:

amen brother ...can't we all just get along

I need another beer:trink26::trink26: