Removing Top Deck? (1987 JS550 Rebuild/Engine Swap)

[smokeysevin]

Nice work there!

Thanks! Is it worth glassing the inside bottom of the hull under the engine? I don't know enough about these hulls to know the weak spots other than the nose area. Having read loads of threads here, I am leaning towards sharpening the chines and doing a single layer of glass on the bottom (outside) of the hull so extra glass on the inside may not be needed.

I am also thinking (after my glass work 3 post) that I may handle the remaining nose work on the outside of the hull rather than trying to do the contours on the inside. I wasn't able to dig deep enough in my nose to get the handle pole area reinforced to where I think it should be. NOTE: I also don't know how much is needed, just that this poor ski crashed into something in a past life and was not repaired correctly.

My goal for this week is to be done with the inside of the hull so I can get it cleaned up and painted with bilge kote and move on to the outside. Fingers crossed, my 750 will show up this week so I can start doing drains, exhaust, and other mounts.

Sean

 

[Carrera911]

I'm in the same boat right now trying to repair / reinforce the pole mount area. Mine is about 1/4" thick now and I'd like to add about 1/4" material. I have 1708 and 1208 like you're using on hand. They're .044 and .037" thick respectively. So I was thinking 5-6 layers 1708 or 6-7 layers 1208 depending on which I use, probably both in different areas.

It seems like most people epoxy on a 3/16 or 1/4" dowel rod on the chines and lay glass over that. Harbor freight sells 3/16 fiberglass rod for fishing wires. It looks to be painted, which might be a pain to strip off but you can find them bare from other sellers. I think that would be a good strong option that can't get waterlogged.

 

[smokeysevin]

I'm in the same boat right now trying to repair / reinforce the pole mount area. Mine is about 1/4" thick now and I'd like to add about 1/4" material. I have 1708 and 1208 like you're using on hand. They're .044 and .037" thick respectively. So I was thinking 5-6 layers 1708 or 6-7 layers 1208 depending on which I use, probably both in different areas.

It seems like most people epoxy on a 3/16 or 1/4" dowel rod on the chines and lay glass over that. Harbor freight sells 3/16 fiberglass rod for fishing wires. It looks to be painted, which might be a pain to strip off but you can find them bare from other sellers. I think that would be a good strong option that can't get waterlogged.

That is an interesting idea on the fish rods, I was planning to stop by hf today at lunch anyways to get some new gloves. Do you happen to have an item number?

The biggest problem I have with doing the nose work is that I can't get all the old crap out of the inside so I can get a good bond. I am worried if I try to cover much more than I already have it won't stick. I just can't get in to sand those parts of the hull. Maybe I should have split the decks...

Sean

 

[Carrera911]

https://www.harborfreight.com/3-16-inch-x-11-ft-fiberglass-wire-running-kit-65327.html

It is definitely a pain to try and get access up there with the hull flipped upside down, wearing googles, respirator and even headphones because of the sound and resonance grinding inside the hull. Your 550 is even tighter access I'm sure. The angle grinder with 60 grit flap disc is fastest wherever you can fit it. The pneumatic straight / 90* die grinders and the HF air finger sander are really the only option in tighter areas. All of those are at HF for a total of about 50 bucks. I've been using 2" sanding discs and using the sponge pad under it for curved areas. In other tight areas 1" flap discs work good too. The hard part is getting the surface really smooth and not wavy. When you're laying up the glass, it sticks great to a perfectly smooth surface like the factory SMC, but when it's all wavy it likes to pull up and form bubbles. Also, don't buy your sandpaper at HD or even HF, its wayyy cheaper on amazon. Not as good as 3M, but we're grinding fiberglass not steel.

https://www.harborfreight.com/38-in-belt-air-sander-60627.html

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07R4SLL8T/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07J46JT26/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[smokeysevin]

Great thanks!

I have actually been my HF 90 degree die grinder with a red 3" scotch brite pad to remove most of the old poly resin and a stubby die grinder and carbide burr on the cracks. On the nose area, I can't get my head in to see anything so its mostly been "Jesus take the sanding wheel" up there. The gotcha I seem to fall into all the time is getting the discharge air blowing back in my face/head with the air tools. I like using the 5" electric sander where possible because I have it hooked directly to my shop vac with a hepa filter bag on it. It really cuts down on the dust.

I have also been looking at one of these Milwaukee M12 Die Grinders. its expensive but portable and should limit the blowback.

My go to for abrasive stuff is Benchmark Abrasives, they aren't the cheapest but seem to last substantially longer and they do free/discounted stuff fairly regularly. I also have found that for the 2" roloc discs that the ones from northern tool seem to hold up better. The biggest killer of discs for me though is catching the edges and shredding them. That is mostly because ate the edge of the backing pad though.



Sean

 

[Carrera911]

The air output is definitely a drawback to the air tools. A lot of oil mist also comes out, which I figure isn't good for where I plan to lay glass. I wrapped a shop towel around the base of the grinder where the air output is and zip tied it there and on the hose. This kept the dust storm down some and hopefully traps all the oil.

I've looked at the m12 die grinder and the m12 soldering iron. They seem super handy, but I think they're a bit too proud of them considering they cost more than a drill or impact. I'm pretty sure mechanically it's just a drill without a gearbox, or with a much higher speed gearbox. I have the brushless 4 1/2 grinder but due to the size / weight/ battery life I usually just use the corded ones if I'm in the shop.

Oh benchmark abrasives is great, they're my go to if they offer what I'm after. The 4 1/2" discs last as long as the diablos, only I can get 3-4 for the cost of one lol.

 

[smokeysevin]

The air output is definitely a drawback to the air tools. A lot of oil mist also comes out, which I figure isn't good for where I plan to lay glass. I wrapped a shop towel around the base of the grinder where the air output is and zip tied it there and on the hose. This kept the dust storm down some and hopefully traps all the oil.

I've looked at the m12 die grinder and the m12 soldering iron. They seem super handy, but I think they're a bit too proud of them considering they cost more than a drill or impact. I'm pretty sure mechanically it's just a drill without a gearbox, or with a much higher speed gearbox. I have the brushless 4 1/2 grinder but due to the size / weight/ battery life I usually just use the corded ones if I'm in the shop.

Oh benchmark abrasives is great, they're my go to if they offer what I'm after. The 4 1/2" discs last as long as the diablos, only I can get 3-4 for the cost of one lol.

I typically only buy red tools when they have a promo going on, otherwise they are pricy. The little soldering iron is excellent but man it chews through the smaller batteries. Its a special use case where I am not near an outlet (can't replace my big hakko) and don't want to use my portasol butane (flammable fumes).

100% on the battery life/power of the bigger tools when in the shop. I find myself reaching for my makita and cord reel before I grab the red battery powered one.

Sean

 

[mikidymac]

Just a fyi, it is better to avoid glassing on the outside of the hull if you want a nice paint finish. Any glass you add on the outside is going to add height to the surface of the hull that will stand out when you paint it and is also much harder to get smooth.

 

[smokeysevin]

Just a fyi, it is better to avoid glassing on the outside of the hull if you want a nice paint finish. Any glass you add on the outside is going to add height to the surface of the hull that will stand out when you paint it and is also much harder to get smooth.

I figured that would be the case, I am just concerned that I won't be able to do a proper job on the inside of the nose and if I don't reinforce it now I would pay for it later.

Sean

 

[smokeysevin]

Inner Glasswork Part 5 (Kicking the Itches)

Not too much to report, I filled the gap between the hood flange and inner hull with cabosil and shredded glass and let it tack up. I then cut a 28"×6" piece of 1208 and laid that up flush with the hood flange and wrapped it back to the inner hull. I also added another 2 layers where the nose meets the hood flange. I am hoping that this will make that whole area much stiffer. Its been unpleasant sanding the flange area because the sander makes the whole thing resonate. Even with hearing protection on it is enough to make my ears ring.

Yesterday I stopped at HF and picked up some of the fiberglass rods mentioned earlier in the thread. I got one out and cut the threaded ends off to experiment with. The good news is that the rods are just fiberglass with colored resin, the glossy coating on the outside is knocked off really easily. The bad news is that they are 37" long once cut, so a little on the short side.

Time Spent:
4 Hours (seriously why does this take so damn long?)

Tools Used:
Rockwell Oscillating Multi Tool
5" Orbital Sander
Shop Vac
Mixing Cups
Mixing Stick
Clamps clamps and more clamps

Materials Used:
8 OZ Acetone
4 Blue Shop Towels
16 OZ Resin/Hardener
12" 1208 Cloth
2 Hazard Fart Paint Brush
Painters Tape

Old Repairs Removed:
None but I did chip some paint off the bottom using a chisel so I have that to look forward to.

Times I farted in the tyvek suit and nearly passed out:
6 (damn cliff bars)

Beer Consumed:
Shiner Prickly Pear

Dinner Cooked:
Reverse Seared Ribeye with fresh thyme and rosemary from the garden

Music Listened to:
Straight outta junior high: Kiss of Deaf

PPE Used:
Half Respirator
Tyvek Suit
3M Worktunes Headhones
Hazard Frito 7mil blue bomber gloves

Percentage of Garage Floor Epoxy Coated
18% (running total to date, I didn't spill anything that I am aware of today

Percentage complete:
85% (I think I am okay with the repair/reinforcement now, I will have a little sanding to do before I can prep for Bilge Kote)

Sean

Administer the Clamps

Fish Sticks

Punji Stick

When I grow up, I want to be a chine

 

[smokeysevin]

Lower Deck Prep Part 1 (Keep Your Bottom Clean)

Today's first task was to remove any stray splinters from the inside of the hull so I don't stab myself during assembly. I knocked the inside down with 80 grit and sucked the dust up with the shop vac. Once I was happy with the inside I unslung the ski from the hoist and put it back on the stand with the bottom deck up. The bottom deck had a really poorly applied and flaking layer of gel kote that was applied over no less than 3 other layers of paint, primer, and filler. Since the bottom needed work all that needs to get removed. I tried using regular sanding discs, the multitool and in desperation grabbed my trusty makita and flap disk which also didn't do much. Since it was chipping off anyways I helped it along with my trusty chisel. Two and a half hours later the bottom surface of the bottom deck just has paint remaining.

Jumping back to the top deck for a minute, I am still uncertain about the bond line between the nose and engine bay, is there any reason I can't add a layer of glass in the channel for the hood gasket?

Time Spent:
3 Hours (I can barely type because my hands are cramped so bad)

Tools Used:
Rockwell Oscillating Multi Tool
5" Orbital Sander
Makita 4.5" Angle Grinder with 100 grit flap disc
1" Wood Chisel
Shop Vac

Materials Used:
None today

Pounds of Old Flaking Gel Kote Removed:
71 (Estimated)

Beer Consumed:
Karbach Lemon Ginger Radler (Look I can be fancy too okay, drink what you like)

PPE Used:
Half Respirator
Tyvek Suit
3M Worktunes Headhones
Hazard Frito 7mil blue bomber gloves

Percentage of Garage Floor Epoxy Coated
18% (running total to date, I didn't spill anything that I am aware of today

Percentage complete:
25% (the bottom doesn't have gel kote on it anymore but it needs a lot of sanding, filling, and prep)

Sean

My Bare Bottom

 

[smokeysevin]

Lower Deck Prep Part 2 (Wipe Until Clean)

I started today by cleaning up the disaster that my garage had become. Let me be honest here, it was always a disaster but I normally don't work with fiberglass so it was a different kind of disaster. Anyways, since I am getting closer to the point of being ready to run things like exhaust and cooling lines I needed to clean up the stock bedplate. Into the blast cabinet it went and 2ish hours later I had a freshly bead blasted and rust free bedplate. Houston is not a particularly dry climate but it was dry enough today that I kept getting shocked by the static buildup from my blast cabinet. It was not the best.

Once that was done, I blasted the bedplate with 2 coats of self etching primer and then some high temp engine paint.

Having gotten that out of the way and having postponed the inevitable long enough, I resumed sanding the bottom deck. This took approximately 4 hours when it was all said and done. I am once again reminded why I despise bodywork. In the process I used 12 80 grit sanding discs, 3 100 grit rollock discs, and 1 3X18 50 grit sanding belt but I was able to remove each of the multiple layers of paint and gelkote.

I also removed the stock hull extensions to prep for the bilge drains, rear exhaust, sponson mounting plates, and cooling lines. I plan to build removable hull extnsions and mount plates so I can get back to stock length, stock +2" and naked length.

Time Spent:
7 Hours (my hands have not stopped vibrating yet...)

Tools Used:
3X18 Belt Sander
90 Degree Die Grinder
5" Orbital Sander
1" Wood Chisel
Stainless Steel Wire Brush
Drill and 5/16" Drill Bit
Shop Vac

Materials Used:
None today

Layers of Paint Removed:
6 (Seriously

Water Consumed:
64oz (Spring is here peeps, stay hydrated)

PPE Used:
Half Respirator
Tyvek Suit
3M Worktunes Headhones
Hazard Frito 7mil blue bomber gloves

Percentage of Garage Floor Epoxy Coated
18% (running total to date, I didn't spill anything that I am aware of today)

Percentage complete:
50% (I am ready to start adding filler and glass now)

Sean

Well Seasoned Bedplate

Beadblasted and Rattle Canned with High Heat Chemical Resistant Paint

The Jawbreaker

Naked SMC

Tunnel and Transom (Sounds like a good buddy cop movie)

 

[smokeysevin]

Lower Deck Prep Part 3 (Chine On You Crazy Diamond)

This was a relatively quick and simple day. I took 4 of the fish sticks from a few posts ago and trimmed off the ends on the bandsaw (for freshness) then dressed them so there were no splinters. I then sanded the length with some leftover "Used" 5" 80 grit discs from yesterday and got to work taping them out. I followed the stock hull lines as much as possible and made sure the distance from the edge of the hull was the same on both sides.

Once I was happy with where they were, I mixed up some peanut butter and smeared that down the fish sticks until I was reasonably happy with the fitup. I figure I will end up going in and trimming the end to length once it cures and then I can fill in the gaps left by the tape and do a layer of glass over the bottom.

Time Spent:
2 Hours (taping straight lines is not a skill I have)

Tools Used:
Milwaukee Portaband and Swag Table
Porter Cable Upright Belt Sander

Materials Used:
4OZ Resin
4 Scoops of Cabosil
Painters Tape
Sanding Disc

"Fish Sticks" Consumed
4

PPE Used:
Half Respirator
3M Worktunes Headhones
Hazard Frito 7mil blue bomber gloves

Percentage of Garage Floor Epoxy Coated
18% (running total to date, I am on a roll with this no spill thing)

Percentage complete:
62.5% (I am ready to start adding filler and glass now)

Sean

Remember when you were young

You shone like the sun

Chine on, you crazy diamond

Now there's a look in your eyes

Like black holes in the sky

 

[smokeysevin]

Lower Deck Reinforcement Part 1 of 1 (This is probably the end, you should go to bed and stop reading here.)

Continuing on the theme from yesterday, I once again ventured into the realm of smearing peanut butter along fish sticks. This was to fill the gaps left by my structural painters tape. Once that was complete, I applied 8oz of resin to the whole bottom deck and waited for that to setup. While that was kicking, I cut qty 3 12" wide sections of 1208 and prepared them for the bottom. I started at the back and layered them sort of like shark skin. I cut one of the 50" lengths in half and positioned that at the nose. I then cut 3 6" X 16" sections and used that to cover the gap left by the 12" wide sections and laid that up to the nose. Then the time came to raid the scrap section where I found lots of small squares and used that to fill in the nose sections and cover the old "repairs". Its not perfect but its "serviceable" and it will get covered with black gel kote so who cares.

I ventured into the house to cure the stomach rumbles and got suckered into being a good husband so I kicked around on the couch watching terrible reality tv until I was once again saved by the catalytic miracle that is epoxy resin!

All my pre cut pieces were placed, and smoothed until my next 20 minutes were up. The next 16oz of resin was mixed and applied to wet out the glass. I then spent another 30ish minutes making sure all the corners were tucked and the bubbles were out. All in all, I think this went okay but the cruel light of morning will reveal my inadequacies.


Time Spent:
4 Hours (I made a turkey sandwich, and was forced to watch the end of an episode of The Bachelor by my wife while I was waiting on the resin to kick. This alone is reason enough to use fast cure resin, learn from my mistakes!)

Tools Used:
Rockwell Oscillating Multi Tool
Porter Cable 5" Orbital Sander
Shop Vac

Materials Used:
24OZ Resin
4 Scoops of Cabosil
48" 1208
Sanding Disc

Reality TV watched while waiting for the resin to kick:
The Bachelor: Women Tell All (Send help)

PPE Used:
Half Respirator
Tyvek Suit
3M Worktunes Headhones
Hazard Frito 7mil blue bomber gloves

Percentage of Garage Floor Epoxy Coated
24% (That escalated quickly, I mean, this really got out of hand fast)

Percentage complete:
75% (Could the end be near for our ruggedly handsome hero? Tune in tomorrow for another exciting misadventure!)

Sean

Trimmed and Filed Fangs (I even measured the cuts)

Smooth and Sticky

Fully Clothed and Dry

Like Papier-Mache, except toxic, and expensive, and water resistant

 

[jaxrider]

good idea with the rods

 

[smokeysevin]

good idea with the rods

That was all @Carrera911 and they seem to have worked brilliantly.

Sean

 

[Carrera911]

Thanks, last year I read through a ton of old builds and dowel rods seemed how everyone did it. I thought about the drawbacks of using wood and the 8’ fish sticks I have seemed like they’d work better. Can’t get water logged and much less compressible. I didn’t do it on my rn because it hooks up plenty good for me. But having ridden a couple 550s, some better chines should really help out with handling.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[mikidymac]

Just a FYI, gelcoat doesn't like to stick to epoxy.

 

[smokeysevin]

Just a FYI, gelcoat doesn't like to stick to epoxy.

That is really interesting. I just assumed it would. Saved me lots of time and pain.

I have used interlux brightsides topside paint several times and been happy with it as a top deck paint, do you think it would hold up on a bottom deck?

Sean

Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk

 

[mikidymac]

The only thing that really holds up is gelcoat but as long as you don't beach it paint will be fine. The superjets are just painted on the bottom.