SB Billet / DASA Lamey v.s. WDK 1200 / GP Conversion

[GIL]

More than 5, the crank wheels are bigger as well. It will altogether no doubt to be a heavier package all around.

Brian

Doubtful it is 15MM stroke, the biggest stroke that I have seen in a stock case is 12MM and at times, that is too big for the factory cases.

I am thinking the bottom end "hit" of the larger stroke will overcome the engines' increased mass.

Brian

Thats what I was thinking, it all boils down to Hp/weight ratio, right?lol

 

[carbonjet]

More than 5, the crank wheels are bigger as well. It will altogether no doubt to be a heavier package all around.

Brian

Doubtful it is 15MM stroke, the biggest stroke that I have seen in a stock case is 12MM and at times, that is too big for the factory cases.

I am thinking the bottom end "hit" of the larger stroke will overcome the engines' increased mass.

Brian

Thanks Brian! So it adds HP or torque or "hit" over the standard modified case then, sorry I'm a little confused bro? I wonder how much horsepower is reduced due to the extra 5 or so pounds being added? Has anyone done the math in that regard?

 

[carbonjet]

Here's the Xmetal motor.. So your billet will plug n play with this?

 

[wsuwrhr]

More power captain!!!!

Thats what I was thinking, it all boils down to Hp/weight ratio, right?lol

More or less. The simple answer is yes.

The boat still needs to be able to be "freestyled", weight is everything, balance is everything.....but if the ski launches out of the water farther....

Brian

 

[wsuwrhr]

The case only holds the crank. The case is definitely stronger, but the main reason I built a new case is there is NO WAY anything bigger than a 12MM is going into a factory case.

The longer stroke will give it more bottom end, or "hit" as I would call it.
Horsepower is not reduced at all, increased is more like it, Dan and Kyle figure the motor will make 200HP(or more) set up right. Total powerplant weight will be increased by 10lbs I think.

I am not a freestyler, so it remains to be seen if the power makes up for the difference in mass.

Brian

Thanks Brian! So it adds HP or torque or "hit" over the standard modified case then, sorry I'm a little confused bro? I wonder how much horsepower is reduced due to the extra 5 or so pounds being added? Has anyone done the math in that regard?

 

[wsuwrhr]

Of course, it is identical dimensionally the same as a cast case. The only problem would be the port configuration at the cylinder base. Without seeing their cylinder base, there is no way I could say for sure. I could certainly MAKE it fit, I would just have to have look see.

Do you know the stroke size for sure?

Brian

Shoot a call to me anytime at the shop if you want to talk in depth about it, or if anyone else has any questions.

951-361-3442

Here's the Xmetal motor.. So your billet will plug n play with this?

 

[wsuwrhr]

CJet,

I have friends in Vegas, we were just there a couple weeks ago. Maybe next time we could meet up and you can check out for yourself.

 

[FL-cracker]

Thank you Brian.

I believe the stroke they use on my setup is 15mm.. So I'm guessing this would add like 5lbs to my ski or perhaps more? It really looks like it will last a lifetime, my only hesitation is the added weight. Perhaps you and some of the other members wish to give there 2 cents on if that weight difference is a cause for alarm, in consideration of spending so much $$ for a light hull.. Bobby and Patrick might :nutkick: me.. :biggrin:

Scott, that boat is going to send you into space, you wont feel the extra weight.

To let you know, your motor and pump setup is already probably 20lbs heavier then stock. Figure 10lbs for the Billet head and Billet cylinder, a few more for all that stoke + bigger pistons.... Mag pumps are heavier then OEM by quite a bit as well.

And that pretty RRP pole in Bobby's shop is another 5lbs plus heavier then a stocker.:27:

I hope your hitting the weights man, because you are gona have alot to hold onto..... I have ridden Pat's Orange 1000cc :scared:

Sorry for getting off topic.

Personally I would never play Jeff's games again.

I do like the add asurance of these new Dasa cases. Big props.....

But i like ported 701's.....Big motor's are for people with big pockets..... You boys can keep your lake riding. :thumbsdown:

 

[carbonjet]

Awesome!! I will shoot you a call on Monday morning or tomorrow if that's cool.. Yeah if your out my way I would like to meet up for sure.. But seriously lets do this I want one!! Or 3 :bananajump:
I'll PM you my cell..

Thanks bro,
-Scott

 

[wsuwrhr]

Thanks for the props.

And I fixed your post for you.

Scott, that boat is going to send you into space, you wont feel the extra weight.

To let you know, your motor and pump setup is already probably 20lbs heavier then stock. Figure 10lbs for the Billet head and Billet cylinder, a few more for all that stoke + bigger pistons.... Mag pumps are heavier then OEM by quite a bit as well.

And that pretty RRP pole in Bobby's shop is another 5lbs plus heavier then a stocker.:27:

I hope your hitting the weights man, because you are gona have alot to hold onto..... I have ridden Pat's Orange 1000cc :scared:

Sorry for getting off topic.

Personally I would never play Jeff's games again.

I do like the add asurance of these new SB Products cases. Big props.....

But i like ported 701's.....Big motor's are for people with big pockets..... You boys can keep your lake riding. :thumbsdown:

 

[FL-cracker]

My Bad. lol

Keep up the good work!

 

[carbonjet]

Scott, that boat is going to send you into space, you wont feel the extra weight.

To let you know, your motor and pump setup is already probably 20lbs heavier then stock. Figure 10lbs for the Billet head and Billet cylinder, a few more for all that stoke + bigger pistons.... Mag pumps are heavier then OEM by quite a bit as well.

And that pretty RRP pole in Bobby's shop is another 5lbs plus heavier then a stocker.:27:

I hope your hitting the weights man, because you are gona have alot to hold onto..... I have ridden Pat's Orange 1000cc :scared:

Sorry for getting off topic.

Personally I would never play Jeff's games again.

I do like the add asurance of these new Dasa cases. Big props.....

But i like ported 701's.....Big motor's are for people with big pockets..... You boys can keep your lake riding. :thumbsdown:

Thanks for the great info Bronson. I've been hitting the gym with that in my mind brother. lol!! I'm def going for these cases, just got off the phone with Brian he's a class act. Stoked!

 

[breed6903]

I too have machined a set of billet crankcases. it is alot of work getting it setup. You should look into making sand cast cases or perm mold. Make the transfer area blank and machine it for whatever cyl you want. You will find that the cases weigh alot more machining them from billet. Once you make the tooling for casting you will be able to make quite a few for very little $$.

 

[carbonjet]

I too have machined a set of billet crankcases. it is alot of work getting it setup. You should look into making sand cast cases or perm mold. Make the transfer area blank and machine it for whatever cyl you want. You will find that the cases weigh alot more machining them from billet. Once you make the tooling for casting you will be able to make quite a few for very little $$.

Just my opinion, but nothing compares to struck & milled billet that started life as a square block. It just says: Yeah baby! :headbang:

 

[wsuwrhr]

"I" should look into making a casting? Why don't you want to do it?

Casting has already been covered ten different ways. I wouldn't mind a friendly discussion about casted parts, but truely, casting for short run complex parts(less than 1-2000) are three times the cost as making them out of billet. With billet parts, anything can be changed on the fly.

Core dimesions always change with castings and those problems only get worse as the casting tooling ages, you are releying on people to assemble to cores correctly, when the castings cool they distort. Casting problems just go on and on. I am over it.

I know when I take parts out of the machine the dimensions are dead nuts, everytime. I don't have to rely on someone else to get me the castings on time and making me look bad in the process. I can place a call and the material I need is here within three days.

When you are done machining a casting, they just look like cast parts machined to look pretty.


Enough of that,

Let's see some pictures of your case. Looks like it is setup for a GPR cylinder.

Brian

I too have machined a set of billet crankcases. it is alot of work getting it setup. You should look into making sand cast cases or perm mold. Make the transfer area blank and machine it for whatever cyl you want. You will find that the cases weigh alot more machining them from billet. Once you make the tooling for casting you will be able to make quite a few for very little $$.

 

[GIL]

Am I a complete dumb azz here or is nobody comprehending power to weight ratio???? C'mon people, if the added weight produces a 2:1 Hp:weight ratio, then who cares how much Brian's billet cases weigh???
What ever happened to common sense, is it a thing of the past? If so-make u some light weight cases out of styrofoam and start another thread about how much better your cases are than anyone elses!!! Brian's entire point seems to be, yes, his cases are expemsive, but, the opportunities are endless and u will NEVER have to buy another set!!! So, get over yourselves!

 

[carbonjet]

Am I a complete dumb azz here or is nobody comprehending power to weight ratio???? C'mon people, if the added weight produces a 2:1 Hp:weight ratio, then who cares how much Brian's billet cases weigh???
What ever happened to common sense, is it a thing of the past? If so-make u some light weight cases out of styrofoam and start another thread about how much better your cases are than anyone elses!!! Brian's entire point seems to be, yes, his cases are expemsive, but, the opportunities are endless and u will NEVER have to buy another set!!! So, get over yourselves!

Huh? Gil are you ok :aargh4:? I was just asking a question easy buddy.

 

[GIL]

Huh? Gil are you ok :aargh4:? I was just asking a question easy buddy.

I was not referring to u. LOL It's all good.

 

[GIL]

wsuwrhr aka Brian, can I steal this post a sec?

I have 1 of the very last cast Lamey cylinders that was bought from Lamey in Feb of this year. It is time for the annual re-build and I noticed the exhaust ports of the cylinders protrude into the manifold opening alot, but, only on the leading edges of the frt and rear cylinder. I took a couple of lame pics so u can see what I am talking about. WHats your thoughts/opinions? Is there enuf to make a performance issue? It does not appear to me that there is enuf metal to finish matching the ex ports from the cylinder to the manifold. It looks like on the frt cylinder that I would get into the frt cooling jacket real quick.

??? What u think?

Oh yeah, the black sharpie marks on the ex ports is the parts the hang into the openings of the manifold.

 

[wsuwrhr]

I see what you are saying, the bolt pattern seems to be right. What does the ex maifold look like, do the ports look to be in the right spot? Is is possible that the ex manifold can be shifted over?

One ex looks good, the other looks shifted. This is one of the reasons why I pushed so hard to get away from the cast cylinders.

Shoot me a call or let me know if the number in your sig is yours.

Name?

Brian

wsuwrhr aka Brian, can I steal this post a sec?

I have 1 of the very last cast Lamey cylinders that was bought from Lamey in Feb of this year. It is time for the annual re-build and I noticed the exhaust ports of the cylinders protrude into the manifold opening alot, but, only on the leading edges of the frt and rear cylinder. I took a couple of lame pics so u can see what I am talking about. WHats your thoughts/opinions? Is there enuf to make a performance issue? It does not appear to me that there is enuf metal to finish matching the ex ports from the cylinder to the manifold. It looks like on the frt cylinder that I would get into the frt cooling jacket real quick.

??? What u think?

Oh yeah, the black sharpie marks on the ex ports is the parts the hang into the openings of the manifold.