Custom Made Freestyle Hulls

[Rickster]

Imagine if we had money like F1?? We could really make quality parts that will last, be light weight and made to a standard we can't even imagine..

The F1 cars are not made to last any longer than one season, or one crash.

You had me until that.....

Even the big offshore race boats get turned over to smaller syndicates, who then rebuild and modify because they cannot afford a brand new boats.

Maybe, we just expect too much, wanting light and strong, in the conditions these boats are used.

:dunno:

 

[GDFL]

my opinion as a person who has been in manufacturing for 15 years, so take it as you want....

The the problem w/ making quality parts in this buisness, is market is just not big enough and there is not enough money in this sport to fund a decent R&D program... Christ, why would someone spend $100,000.00 (or whatever) to design a perfect hull, unbreakable hull that weighs 40lbs when they will only sell enough to pay for the electric bill at the manufacturing facility??? That is just not gonna keep the doors open

IMO there are enough replica hulls available already, they just need to be refined, expanded upon and prices lowered... I don't know too much about running a buisness, but to me, it would seem like a bad thing to have so many different hulls available, when the industy doesn't have a market for them... In turn you just have more companies selling less product, making each company less able to expand or make money on their efforts.. I may be wrong, but it's just a way of thinking about it... I understand flooding the market makes things cheaper too, but look at the WAL MART philosophy... they have forced all these company's to have their stuff made in China just to compete... (basicly trying to run companies out of buisness and making company's make products of less quality).

It just looks like our sport is too small for the latest in technology... Imagine if we had money like F1?? We could really make quality parts that will last, be light weight and made to a standard we can't even imagine.. Actaully there is one hull out there that almost lives up to those standards... the Light-Weight hull and it's $13k (before delivery)

That sounds about right. This market is just too small for much more competition. I'd say it's borderline saturated as it is. I wonder if it would be worth it to contract manufacturers of other products that use the same technology. I know of a flats boat manufacturer that makes some sweet carbon fiber boats. That's probably the way to go....use someone else's established R & D and facilities rather than trying to tool up yourself.

 

[Powder]

The F1 cars are not made to last any longer than one season, or one crash.

You had me until that.....

not all the parts. I did some work for a company that made a lot of F1 parts and you would pooh your pants if you saw the tech that goes into something as simple as a lug nut. Also the parts that break are designed to break a special way so the driver or other drivers aren't killed.


Sluty is right on the money. There is barely a market for OEM skis forget about a healthy profit margin (or any profit) on a quality aftermarket hull. If you want an ultimate hull build it your self or find 500-600 of your closes friends to place an advanced order and I am sure some one will step up to the plate with a bargain ultimate unbreakable lightweight hull for $7k (after about 2 years refining the process and finding materials to fit within the budget). Technology is expensive. Or you could shell out $5k for the next closes thing from WFC and have it in a month or so. Personally in my opinion probably 80% of the people on here aren’t at a level where it will make a difference OEM vs aftermarket. Also most people would benefit more form from a few less trips to McD’s and few more to the salad bar vs. a high price hull. Imagine what spending 5K on a personal trainer would do for your riding level.

 

[FL-cracker]

that's what Trinity did/does from what i understand. :sneaky:

:sneaky: :sneaky: :sneaky: :biggthumpup: :Banane01: :haha:

 

[Rickster]

not all the parts.

Hull = chassis

Also most people would benefit more form from a few less trips to McD’s and few more to the salad bar vs. a high price hull.

I agree 100%

 

[FL-cracker]

^^^^Agreed......Get good on a heavy boat then switch over.......then you will be busting shiet huge! Weight is a much bigger issue for flatwater then it is for the Surf. imo

 

[douglee25]

my opinion as a person who has been in manufacturing for 15 years, so take it as you want....

The the problem w/ making quality parts in this buisness, is market is just not big enough and there is not enough money in this sport to fund a decent R&D program... Christ, why would someone spend $100,000.00 (or whatever) to design a perfect hull, unbreakable hull that weighs 40lbs when they will only sell enough to pay for the electric bill at the manufacturing facility??? That is just not gonna keep the doors open

IMO there are enough replica hulls available already, they just need to be refined, expanded upon and prices lowered... I don't know too much about running a buisness, but to me, it would seem like a bad thing to have so many different hulls available, when the industy doesn't have a market for them... In turn you just have more companies selling less product, making each company less able to expand or make money on their efforts.. I may be wrong, but it's just a way of thinking about it... I understand flooding the market makes things cheaper too, but look at the WAL MART philosophy... they have forced all these company's to have their stuff made in China just to compete... (basicly trying to run companies out of buisness and making company's make products of less quality).

It just looks like our sport is too small for the latest in technology... Imagine if we had money like F1?? We could really make quality parts that will last, be light weight and made to a standard we can't even imagine.. Actaully there is one hull out there that almost lives up to those standards... the Light-Weight hull and it's $13k (before delivery)

I agree with some points, but honestly pricing at this point for aftermarket hulls is out of my range and many others for that matter. The only one I'd consider because of strength/price would be the WCF ski. The other manufacturers charge what they do because the market is so small and only a few can afford it. Do you honestly think that the EME ski has $42,000 worth of parts and labor into it? I don't think so. Again, I am not taking away from Malone's ski at all. It's a work of art but it's out of my price range. If a new manufacturer comes to town and can produce something for a good price (ie a new hull design), then the competitors either lower their price to compete, or they go out of business. At the same time, the other competitors lower their price, and despite their margins decreasing, their overall net increases due to increased sales. It's really a win win for everyone.

Doug

 

[Prem1x]

:haha: I think that is in Braptopia ! :headbang:

Unfortuneately, Braptopia does not export :clown:

 

[PancakePete]

I agree with some points, but honestly pricing at this point for aftermarket hulls is out of my range and many others for that matter. The only one I'd consider because of strength/price would be the WCF ski. The other manufacturers charge what they do because the market is so small and only a few can afford it. Do you honestly think that the EME ski has $42,000 worth of parts and labor into it? I don't think so. Again, I am not taking away from Malone's ski at all. It's a work of art but it's out of my price range. If a new manufacturer comes to town and can produce something for a good price (ie a new hull design), then the competitors either lower their price to compete, or they go out of business. At the same time, the other competitors lower their price, and despite their margins decreasing, their overall net increases due to increased sales. It's really a win win for everyone.

Doug

2 MANY HULL BUILDERS FOR A TINY MARKET WILL EQUAL ALL GOING OUT OF BIS. :frown:

 

[Rickster]

The only reason the majority of us cannot afford/justifypurchasing an aftermarket hull, is you have to pay for it in shot instead of $20 at a time.

Anyones with a limited RN on this board has a $6K+ ski (to build) but most of us chose to do it over time, which does not hurt the pocket book as much and is not as hard to justify to the misses.:sneaky:

Hell, a new b-pipe along is almost $700 new and $450 used....:bigeyes: and that's only a fraction the cost fo building a freeride ski....

 

[Powder]

Do you honestly think that the EME ski has $42,000 worth of parts and labor into it? I don't think so......If a new manufacturer comes to town and can produce something for a good price (ie a new hull design), then the competitors either lower their price to compete, or they go out of business. At the same time, the other competitors lower their price, and despite their margins decreasing, their overall net increases due to increased sales. It's really a win win for everyone.

Doug

SHUT UP I get so sick of seeing you respond to things you know nothing about. Let me guess you took a business 101 class in college so you know everything about business. If business models were that black and white and we were dealing in a Utopian economy then maybe you would have a valid point.

Unfortuneately, Braptopia does not export :clown:

I think NAFTA has something to do with that.

 

[yamaslut]

2 MANY HULL BUILDERS FOR A TINY MARKET WILL EQUAL ALL GOING OUT OF BIS. :frown:

that would be my point... we need minimal makers w/ people supporting them... that way the builders can afford to upgrade, and lower prices... I forget, but I think it takes about 20 sold hulls to pay for the process... and to start being profitable...
:frown:

 

[yamaslut]

The only reason the majority of us cannot afford/justifypurchasing an aftermarket hull, is you have to pay for it in shot instead of $20 at a time.

Anyones with a limited RN on this board has a $6K+ ski (to build) but most of us chose to do it over time, which does not hurt the pocket book as much and is not as hard to justify to the misses.:sneaky:

Hell, a new b-pipe along is almost $700 new and $450 used....:bigeyes: and that's only a fraction the cost fo building a freeride ski....

Chuck at CG Racing is going to offer financing on XFT hulls (if I read correctly) this is a fantastic way to make these hull affordabe. I don't know to many people who can afford to drop 3k or more at one time, or want to put that on a credit card. finacing will sell hulls. It actually is the only possible way I could do it.

 

[Frosty]

that would be my point... we need minimal makers w/ people supporting them... that way the builders can afford to upgrade, and lower prices... I forget, but I think it takes about 20 sold hulls to pay for the process... and to start being profitable...
:frown:

Chuck at CG Racing is going to offer financing on XFT hulls (if I read correctly) this is a fantastic way to make these hull affordabe. I don't know to many people who can afford to drop 3k or more at one time, or want to put that on a credit card. finacing will sell hulls. It actually is the only possible way I could do it.

Solid.. I would buy a WCF or an XFT hull in a second if: 1. I didn't have to pay for my daughter's college education and up coming wedding and 2. my wife would promise not cut my nutz off for spending that much cash on just a hull.

I easily have $7 into my RN, and spend another $500 - $1000 a year in PM, up grades, and repairs (since lately find it necessary to hit bottom ). But if I could finance an aftermarket hull then I would be more likely to buy one. I wish I had more discapline to put some WCF fund cash away every week. Probably be able to buy one next year.

You are right though Nick, the OEM don't even sell enough to justify retooling.

 

[Rickster]

financing is definitely the key for some, justification is the key to others...

I personally could not justify purchasing an aftermarket hull until I learn to ride the hulls I have.:biggrin:

And I would dare say most on this board are in the same boat, financing or not.

 

[Matt_E]

Do you honestly think that the EME ski has $42,000 worth of parts and labor into it? I don't think so..

:bs2: There is A LOT MORE to that cost than parts & labor. :bs2:

Actaully there is one hull out there that almost lives up to those standards... the Light-Weight hull and it's $13k

Not to take away from the Lightweight hull....but there are better ones out there (if we're just talking quality).
The Lightweight hull is wet-layup CF.

The french carbon hull is pre-preg - much better (compositech). Don't know the price.

The Pre-preg REV hulls WDK makes (all 3 of them...LOL) are probably better, too.

 

[yamaslut]

:bs2: There is A LOT MORE to that cost than parts & labor. :bs2:



Not to take away from the Lightweight hull....but there are better ones out there (if we're just talking quality).
The Lightweight hull is wet-layup CF.

The french carbon hull is pre-preg - much better (compositech). Don't know the price.

The Pre-preg REV hulls WDK makes (all 3 of them...LOL) are probably better, too.

whatever... the point was the amount of money spent for quality... put whatever name in there you like...

 

[Matt_E]

You are right. If you want a quality hull that's worth the money, you get what you pay for.
(Lenzi's stuff may be an exception)

 

[douglee25]

SHUT UP I get so sick of seeing you respond to things you know nothing about. Let me guess you took a business 101 class in college so you know everything about business. If business models were that black and white and we were dealing in a Utopian economy then maybe you would have a valid point.

Wow, that was a little harsh? Actually, I ran my own business for about 15 years. In fact, I still own it, but don't actually run it. I would like to think my post has some validity.

Doug

 

[Powder]

Wow, that was a little harsh? Actually, I ran my own business for about 15 years. In fact, I still own it, but don't actually run it. I would like to think my post has some validity.

Doug

Harsh, hardly I toned it down a bit.


Enjoy your company, best of luck.

So back to Hull talk...sorry for the interruption.