Super Jet Still Bogging... it can't be the carb....

[swapmeet]

hello
it sound like pop off circuit is way off
1.check your fuel tank for tightness ,every time you open the cover you should here a hissing sound (there should be prussure),if not, the one way check valve is malfunction
2 check your oem fuel filter is it 3/4 full or allmost full,this is a good indication for tank under pressure
3 do you run b pipe did you open the upper screw
4 your pop off should be 17-20 psi (are you running single)
5 is the engine over reving outside the water when you hit the throtle ?(air leak)

1. Generally it's pressurized. That's why I removed my primer and fuel selector.
The check valve is good.
2. Not 100% sure on the filter. I'll check.
3. I have a Bpipe. Not sure why/what adjusting screw does.
4 pop off is closer to 26, both group k and mukini reccomend a high popoff.
5 I've pressure tested recently with no leaks. It doesn't free rev out of the water.


The carb is a SBN44

 

[Watcon]

Put in 35cc domes and re-test with the skinny impeller. Make sure your timing is correct, as its easy to accidentally "retard" the timing when installing the stator. I know it sounds "old school" but review the tuning tips I posted somewhere on the site. If the transfer ports have been raised, you will have a difficult time getting it to leave hard with the lower compression ratio.

regards,
Randy

 

[swapmeet]

Put in 35cc domes and re-test with the skinny impeller. Make sure your timing is correct, as its easy to accidentally "retard" the timing when installing the stator. I know it sounds "old school" but review the tuning tips I posted somewhere on the site. If the transfer ports have been raised, you will have a difficult time getting it to leave hard with the lower compression ratio.

regards,
Randy

The domes it has should have raised the compression. I apologize for my confusion. I understand how the less CC's of the dome increases compression, but since i'm not 100% sure what I have its tough to be sure. Given the results of my compression test, and where Protec says it should be on my engine I would say my compression is low.

I haven't touched the stator. Haven't even pulled the flywheel cover on this engine. So nothing should have been bumped.
That being said, I can try to check the timing. Nobody else has suggested it so I didn't think that would be the issue.

I used your tuning tips (in conjunction with GroupK's) when trying to tune this problem via the carb with no noticeabe results.
What transfer ports are you refering to? I'm not familliar.


Heres another video, the last pull at 40sec is the most obvious example of what i'm dealing with.

 

[yamanube]

Have you tried a new coil?

 

[swapmeet]

Not yet. Haven't touched it since yesterday's testing.
I don't have a new coil to swap out, so my plan was to possibly test mine?
I didn't know if that was something that would be useful, but haven't had a chance to do anything.

 

[WAB]

Maybe the stator plate screws vibed loose .....

 

[swapmeet]

That wouldn't suprise me, my engine shakes like Michael J Fox having a Orgasm.

 

[swapmeet]

Ok, found this while looking for coil testing proceedures. Just posting so if someone else is looking they don't have to go searching.

Before installing a bunch of parts you should check the resistance of the ignition coil and stator pulser coil.

Just use an ohm meter with the coil disconnected and measures the primary resistance across the orange and black wires; it should be between .078 to .106 ohms at 68F degrees.

Also check the secondary resistance across both spark plug high tension leads and it should be 3.5 to 4.7 ohms at 68F degrees.

To check the pulser coil on the stator just unplug the white/red wire and black ground wire; it should be between 12.6 to 15.4 ohms at 68F degrees.

You should also check the spark plug gap width and resistance if they have built in resistors and should measure less then 6000 ohms.

It's pretty common for spark plug wire ends, spark plugs and pulser coil wires & windings to go bad and if they're out of spec replace only the parts that are needed

I did what is in bold above. I tested the resistance between the plug wires first. They measured out at 46k ohms, just where they should.

Then I opened the ebox.... and found something awesome! (Awesome b/c I hope it helps diagnose this damn bog...)

Standing water!

I tested the orange and black wires on the coil and I had to range my meter to like 200M Ohms to get the reading to register. I assume thats bad, but a lot of people said they got "0.00" on their test. Also I found this...

The wires for the coil have been cut, soldered, and wrapped in electrical tape. The area that wasn't soldered was very corroded, but none of the stands were broken. It looks bad, and i'll probably replace the coil (unless ya'll advise differently) but the soldier joints look strong so to me... the connections should be good right?

Also, there was a lot of this grainy gel on the horizontal surfaces. There was a line on the Enhancer where water had been about an inch deep in the box at some point in time. Is that just corrosion with the aluminum?

A buddy suggested that I add a extra ground, I used the over temp grommet to run the wire.
All of the ground connections, despite the surrounding corrosion, looked solid. There was shiny metal between all the connections.
No need for a image...
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d158/StyleWagons/Jetski/25e814ef.jpg

 

[Matt_E]

That's probably your problem. Replace that coil.
Do yourself a favor and buy a NEW ebox gasket.
Seal it with 1211, put 1211 on all grommets, and box everything back up.

 

[swapmeet]

Should I get a SXR coil or go for the billy bada$$ JSS rebuilt option?

 

[swapmeet]

Update, did more testing after reading quite a few posts where there is a consensus the coil never goes bad, just the plug wires.

Everything measures out. What else should I test? I'll replace the coil, but I think its fine.

 

[Waternut]

Update, did more testing after reading quite a few posts where there is a consensus the coil never goes bad, just the plug wires.

Everything measures out. What else should I test? I'll replace the coil, but I think its fine.

They go bad...I promise. Although that may not be your problem. Have you water tested it since you cleaned up all the electrical connections? Did you ever check your spark?

 

[swapmeet]

Have not water tested. Gonna add the ground to the e-box, and one from the battery ground to the engine.
I have a loaner e-box. No idea weather its a known good unit but i'll give it a try. See if throwing that in solves anything, which would at least give me some direction.

I did test the spark per your instructions, and there was a blue to orange spark on the plugs.

 

[WAB]

WTF, electical tape? that's Bullsht

I would not swap out the WHOLE other box, swap just the coil. But first, I'd get some of the good waterproof (expensive marine ones) butt splices and fix those coil wires better and see if you are running right then.

 

[Waternut]

I would highly recommend fixing your ebox so you can at least to take it to the water with you. By swapping in an ebox that isn't proven to be good is only throwing another unknown into the problem. Adding the ground is a good idea IMO because those seem to go out a lot but when it does go, nothing works.

 

[swapmeet]

Ok, i'll try the other coil first. Then move on.
I can redo that connection and waterproof it with some dielectric grease and heat shrink if my coil ends up not being the issue.

From some of my reading, if water gets in/ around the MSD module, that wreaks havoc on the unit corrrect? I can see a line where my e-box had about a inch of water in it. Can anyone confirm or deny that? My thinking is that the next step is to swap in the stock module in my buddys e-box assuming the coil isn't the problem.

I guess from there I need to pop the flywheel cover, start poking around in there with a stick.


*edit* BTW, thanks a lot for sticking with me throughout this thread. I'm extremely grateful for everyones input.

 

[Matt_E]

An Enhancer either works or it doesn't. I've never heard of one causing the issues you're describing.
A coil, on the other hand, can cause those symptoms.

 

[swapmeet]

Fair enough...
Not 100% on topic, but I'm gonna put my old pump setup back together before I ride Sunday. I had to use a questionable wear ring for the stock setup and I don't want to eff up my impeller. I think I could feel/hear it rubbing/cavitating when I tested it out. Sounded awful...

 

[swapmeet]

Ok quick update. I installed a known good ebox. Good coil, stock CDI.

Same problems, bogs down low. Sort of a hesitation. Nothing different from the videos.
Its almost as if I pull/hop and get the intake out of the water enough to let the motor rev, it will pull hard when it re-loads the pump. Not sure if that makes sense, but if i'm going slow... it just takes forever to wind up, then it hits like a light switch.

I think i'm done. I feel like i've tried everything and nothing helps gives ANY results. I'm gonna find a reputable shop in DFW and start throwing money at it, i'm to the point i'm sick of looking at it. I've never had this much trouble with an motor.
I can't begin to tell you how defeating this is... I keep thinking "Its gotta be _____, cause i've tried everything else!" And then its not whatever is in the blank. Anyway I guess i'm venting at this point.

On a side note, I replaced all the O-rings on the Protec head, still getting lower compression numbers than I believe I should be. I think its 37cc domes, which should yeild 170-180psi on a 61x, and i'm gettin 155 on one cyl, and 160 on another.
Thats awesome.

 

[briank]

iv been having a problem with my ski for weeks and tryed everything from carbs to electrical and finally figured out i had water in my fuel. u might want to check on that, it can really f things up.